import 4.code.options;
import 4.code.about;

class Header{

public void title(){

String fullTitle = "// - ";
}

public void menu();

public void board();

public void goToBottom();

public void refresh(a);

}
class Thread extends Board{
public void Shamanism(OP Anonymous){

String fullTitle = "Shamanism";
int postNumber = "5618864";
String image = "resto shaman.jpg";
String date = "11/08/18(Thu)13:00:51";
String comment = "Did American Shamanism originate natively or did it come from Siberia as people migrated from Siberia to Alaska?";

}
public void comments(){
if(Anonymous && title=="" && postNumber==5619023 && dateTime=="11/08/18(Thu)13:27:52")

">>5618864
Shamanism has been around since before humans left Africa"
;


if(Anonymous && title=="" && postNumber==5619055 && dateTime=="11/08/18(Thu)13:35:56")

">>5618864
Shamanism is the mark of primitive people unable to develop the concept of deities."
;


if(Anonymous && title=="" && postNumber==5619088 && dateTime=="11/08/18(Thu)13:44:12")

">>5619055
Deities are primitive. They're the result of humans thinking that another human is responsible for everything. Can't explain fire? Must be the fire god. Can't explain wind? The wind god. It's a shame that western civilization never progressed beyond this limited way of thinking."
;


if(Anonymous && title=="" && postNumber==5619097 && dateTime=="11/08/18(Thu)13:46:26")

">>5618864
It has many similarities to Siberian shamanism, which in turn has many similarities to shamanism elsewhere, It seems to be pretty primal, but in terms of your question it almost certainly came with people from Siberia.
>>5619055
>>5619088
Most native Americans weren't actually shamanic at all, they were totemists or even full on polytheists."
;


if(Anonymous && title=="" && postNumber==5619101 && dateTime=="11/08/18(Thu)13:48:38")

">>5619088
>It's a shame that western civilization never progressed beyond this limited way of thinking.
no your understanding of polytheism is limited"
;


if(Anonymous && title=="" && postNumber==5619114 && dateTime=="11/08/18(Thu)13:53:10")

">>5619097
Isn't shamanism more of a social mode than a theological outlook? There's a reason that it refers to a person and a social role rather than whatever divine or natural force s/he interfaces with."
;


if(Anonymous && title=="" && postNumber==5619132 && dateTime=="11/08/18(Thu)13:57:57")

">>5619114
There's no basic difference between a shaman and a priest in terms of social mode. It generally refers to the "theology" of animism."
;


if(Anonymous && title=="" && postNumber==5619133 && dateTime=="11/08/18(Thu)13:58:19")

">>5619114
I think the word OP meant was animism"
;


if(Anonymous && title=="" && postNumber==5619147 && dateTime=="11/08/18(Thu)14:02:15")

">>5619101
Elaborate."
;


if(Anonymous && title=="" && postNumber==5619169 && dateTime=="11/08/18(Thu)14:08:07")

">>5619114
A shaman is no different from a preacher in social terms."
;


if(Anonymous && title=="" && postNumber==5619173 && dateTime=="11/08/18(Thu)14:08:16")

">>5619088
Shamanism is muh spirits and shiet its so primitive and simple compared to deities."
;


if(Anonymous && title=="" && postNumber==5619184 && dateTime=="11/08/18(Thu)14:12:06")

">>5619173
Muh spirits is actually LESS retarded than muh gods. A spirit doesn't necessarily have any kind of mind, let alone a personality, it's just an abstraction much like natural forces actually are. A god has a personality and a backstory and wants and desires and all that crap."
;


if(Anonymous && title=="" && postNumber==5619203 && dateTime=="11/08/18(Thu)14:17:17")

">>5619088
>Can't explain fire? Must be the fire god.
animism: want to eat fish? ask the river god for permission first

based on this arguement alone there is no difference between animism and deity worship.
>>5619184
Myths are allegorical too.
fire as a god, is only in a recognizable human form because thats how we are to best remember the stories. because they are stories, with characters and plotlines. these religions in itself do not hinge on these characters but on the ideas they are to portray."
;


if(Anonymous && title=="" && postNumber==5619210 && dateTime=="11/08/18(Thu)14:19:53")

">>5619203
>animism: want to eat fish? ask the river god for permission first
No? At most a shamanic society would tell you to treat the fish with respect and maybe sing a song or something for their spirits.
>Myths are allegorical too.
Too? Nothing allegorical about spirits, they are very literal and direct concepts. Gods being allegorical is a PROBLEM, because people lose track of the fact that the fire god is "really" just fire, and end up thinking he is a being with wants and needs and powers, who needs to be appeased to avoid him burning your hut down."
;


if(Anonymous && title=="" && postNumber==5619219 && dateTime=="11/08/18(Thu)14:21:28")

">>5619203
>fire as a god, is only in a recognizable human form because thats how we are to best remember the stories. because they are stories, with characters and plotlines. these religions in itself do not hinge on these characters but on the ideas they are to portray.
Why do people project their modern-world thought patterns onto ancient people"
;


if(Anonymous && title=="" && postNumber==5619233 && dateTime=="11/08/18(Thu)14:24:30")

">>5619132
>>5619169
I know that -- shamanism is a Sociology 101 term. Preachers, popes and witch doctors all arise out of shamanism, which I understand is the belief that a human can interact more or less directly with divine or natural forces that elude ordinary people.

So-called shamans are associated with animism, but all types of religious community figures derive their status on the premise of shamanism.

>>5619203
>animism: want to eat fish? ask the river god for permission first
More accurately, ask the river itself. It isn't represented by a god, it is one. In polytheism, natural forces and features are usually governed by a super-entity with roughly human characteristics. In animism, as I understand it, there is no distinction at all between the river and the river god."
;


if(Anonymous && title=="" && postNumber==5619237 && dateTime=="11/08/18(Thu)14:24:41")

">>5619210
yes too"
;


if(Anonymous && title=="" && postNumber==5619244 && dateTime=="11/08/18(Thu)14:27:06")

">>5619219
don't pretend to be smart
here's a quick google search


> Xenophanes

Homer and Hesiod have attributed to the gods
all sorts of things which are matters of reproach and censure among men:
theft, adultery and mutual deceit. (frag. 11)

But if horses or oxen or lions had hands
or could draw with their hands and accomplish such works as men,
horses would draw the figures of the gods as similar to horses, and the oxen as similar to oxen,
and they would make the bodies
of the sort which each of them had. (frag. 15)"
;


if(Anonymous && title=="" && postNumber==5619255 && dateTime=="11/08/18(Thu)14:32:00")

">>5619244
These are classical Greek philosophers, not the "unga-bunga" inventors of religion itself"
;


if(Anonymous && title=="" && postNumber==5619284 && dateTime=="11/08/18(Thu)14:42:07")

">>5619210
so taking to fish is good but taking to fire bad?
why one and not the other"
;


if(Anonymous && title=="" && postNumber==5619293 && dateTime=="11/08/18(Thu)14:42:52")

">>5619184
Yet cultures with polytheism were superior to shaminist primitives like niggers, american natives, and abbos."
;


if(Anonymous && title=="" && postNumber==5619303 && dateTime=="11/08/18(Thu)14:44:57")

">>5619293
>niggers

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yoruba_religion

Also didn't all these polytheist get fucked by mongols who were animistic"
;


if(Anonymous && title=="" && postNumber==5619354 && dateTime=="11/08/18(Thu)14:57:35")

">>5619293
>shaminist primitives
Once again, these are animist traditions. Shamanism doesn't mean having shamans."
;


if(Anonymous && title=="" && postNumber==5619363 && dateTime=="11/08/18(Thu)15:00:40")

">>5619233
>So-called shamans are associated with animism, but all types of religious community figures derive their status on the premise of shamanism.
"No." Modern priests do NOT claim any special power to commune with their god. Shamans were a specialist class of spirit-talkers, their modern analogue is in new-age magicians and mediums, not in priests."
;


if(Anonymous && title=="" && postNumber==5619370 && dateTime=="11/08/18(Thu)15:02:02")

">>5619284
Talking to either is retarded. But talking to a fish or to fire is a league away from talking to a god who was "originally" fire (or a fish). The one is a direct attempt to understand natural forces, the other is a fairy tale used by a class of priests to exert social dominance over other humans."
;


if(Anonymous && title=="" && postNumber==5619377 && dateTime=="11/08/18(Thu)15:02:29")

">>5619293
Superior technologically, sure. But in terms of metaphysics polytheism is a big step backwards."
;


if(Anonymous && title=="" && postNumber==5619383 && dateTime=="11/08/18(Thu)15:03:44")

">>5619354
>Shamanism doesn't mean having shamans.
It's literally what it means. Not all animists have shamans, some societies believed that ANYONE could just talk to the spirits. A shaman is a social class of specialist spirit-talkers, societies that feature such a class are the ones meant by "shamanism"."
;


if(Anonymous && title=="" && postNumber==5619392 && dateTime=="11/08/18(Thu)15:05:35")

">>5619303
Most black tribes were animist."
;


if(Anonymous && title=="" && postNumber==5619401 && dateTime=="11/08/18(Thu)15:07:44")

">>5619370
Priest are only a thing in monotheisms, in polytheism no one took them seriously. The creators of polytheistic myths were the people themselves."
;


if(Anonymous && title=="" && postNumber==5619404 && dateTime=="11/08/18(Thu)15:08:55")

">>5619401
>Priest are only a thing in monotheisms, in polytheism no one took them seriously
Completely wrong."
;


if(Anonymous && title=="" && postNumber==5619409 && dateTime=="11/08/18(Thu)15:09:43")

">>5619404
There was no holy word in polytheism since there are multiple gods."
;


if(Anonymous && title=="" && postNumber==5619417 && dateTime=="11/08/18(Thu)15:11:55")

">>5619409
Again, completely wrong."
;


if(Anonymous && title=="" && postNumber==5619429 && dateTime=="11/08/18(Thu)15:13:42")

">>5619417
How so?"
;


if(Anonymous && title=="" && postNumber==5619430 && dateTime=="11/08/18(Thu)15:14:01")

">>5619363
>Modern priests do NOT claim any special power to commune with their god.
They do if they're Pentecostals."
;


if(Anonymous && title=="" && postNumber==5619437 && dateTime=="11/08/18(Thu)15:16:16")

">>5619363
>Modern priests do NOT claim any special power to commune with their god
Come and see America sometime."
;


if(Anonymous && title=="" && postNumber==5619444 && dateTime=="11/08/18(Thu)15:17:15")

">>5619429
Many if not all temple cults claimed to have divine revelation backing their authority, and priests wee a HUGE deal in nearly all ancient societies, to the extent that often only a priest could become king.
>>5619430
>>5619437
That's fair enough I guess, but even among American Protestantism such views are a minority."
;


if(Anonymous && title=="" && postNumber==5619462 && dateTime=="11/08/18(Thu)15:21:08")

">>5619370
> the other is a fairy tale used by a class of priests to exert social dominance over other humans.
that's very cynical

>talking to a fish or to fire
behaviour demonstrates a belief, the talk to the fire fish stuff, that's acting out a world view those people have. it is not so obvious to me that the worship of deities is in any way less advanced

the river, the fish is real because you can see it. is that it? what about consciousness is that real? Gods are a direct attempt to understand things outside of the basic observation that there is life on the earth."
;


if(Anonymous && title=="" && postNumber==5619477 && dateTime=="11/08/18(Thu)15:24:05")

">>5619444
>even among American Protestantism such views are a minority
You're wayyyy off. Even the parishioners think they have a direct line. President George Walker Fucking Bush said God spoke to him and it was un-American to question him on that. It's a widespread belief that isn't even limited to priestly classes."
;


if(Anonymous && title=="" && postNumber==5619491 && dateTime=="11/08/18(Thu)15:26:04")

">>5619462
>that's very cynical
It's not what the people who deified concepts like fire intended I'm sure, but it's what happened.
>behaviour demonstrates a belief, the talk to the fire fish stuff, that's acting out a world view those people have. it is not so obvious to me that the worship of deities is in any way less advanced
I guess it depends what you mean by advanced. It's a more "complex" belief, for sure, but it happens to be less congruent with reality. Not that animism is "scientific" ofc, but it's certainly closer to the modern understanding of the nature of things than deification is.
>what about consciousness is that real?
Fire and rovers don't have consciousness ofc, but treating them as tho they are simple willful entities is closer to the reality of the matter than worshiping them as a god is.
>Gods are a direct attempt to understand things outside of the basic observation that there is life on the earth.
Gods are an abstraction of the basic and innate tendency towards animism. Small children are natural animists, seeing intention in rain clouds and fires and really in everything around them, abstracting that to a god who "controls" or "embodies" these things is more sophisticated, but is it "better"? It certainly has more terrible side effects, in the form of religious coercion and holy wars."
;


if(Anonymous && title=="" && postNumber==5619497 && dateTime=="11/08/18(Thu)15:26:54")

">>5619477
That's not shamanism tho, shamanism requires that ONLY the shaman has the power to commune with spirits. If everyone can do it, that's just regular animism."
;


if(Anonymous && title=="" && postNumber==5619514 && dateTime=="11/08/18(Thu)15:30:33")

">>5619491
> It certainly has more terrible side effects, in the form of religious coercion and holy wars.
>>5619303
>Also didn't all these polytheist get fucked by mongols who were animistic"
;


if(Anonymous && title=="" && postNumber==5619522 && dateTime=="11/08/18(Thu)15:31:40")

">>5619514
Idk why you think the Mongols were a consequence of polytheism."
;


if(Anonymous && title=="" && postNumber==5619540 && dateTime=="11/08/18(Thu)15:34:56")

">>5619522
no i'm saying violence is not a terrible side effect of religion, there's no escape from violence.

>>5619491
shit i have to go do things, nice argueing with you.
praise kek (literally, actually, without exaggeration)"
;


if(Anonymous && title=="" && postNumber==5619553 && dateTime=="11/08/18(Thu)15:37:48")

">>5619497
No, that's just regular inflated egos as stoked by materialist self-help preachers. The preacher, pastor or priest still commands the social role and authority. You can tell by his nice car.

Shamans interpreted dreams and omens witnessed by ordinary people. These kinds of things were forms of communication that ordinary people could receive. The shaman, priest or seer had the social and religious authority to interpret and confirm these communications, because he had not only the power to interface with the divine, but the wisdom to understand the divine. Today, parishioners are encouraged to participate in pastorship by having a whack at their own interpretations, but first the priest tells them that they are special and touched by the Holy Spirit -- essentially, that they must have the same powers. If the guy is worth his tithes, he tells each of them privately that they are actually much more powerful than he is, that God has a very special plan for them, that he can tell by touching their shoulders and lolling his head a little bit.

The spiritual power is more distributed, but it is still the priest's prerogative to distribute, confirm, and nurture that power."
;


if(Anonymous && title=="" && postNumber==5619554 && dateTime=="11/08/18(Thu)15:37:51")

">>5619540
>no i'm saying violence is not a terrible side effect of religion, there's no escape from violence.
That's true ofc, but I was talking specifically about religious violence, No known wars have EVER been waged on behalf of animism, even the Mongols weren't inspired to war BY their religion. As Saint Hitchens once said, "without religion you have good people doing good things and wicked people doing wicked things, in order to get a good person to do wicked things, you need religion""
;


if(Anonymous && title=="" && postNumber==5619559 && dateTime=="11/08/18(Thu)15:38:27")

">>5619540
>shit i have to go do things
>posts on 4chan
That's a damn lie and you know it."
;


if(Anonymous && title=="" && postNumber==5619595 && dateTime=="11/08/18(Thu)15:44:54")

">>5619553
>No, that's just regular inflated egos as stoked by materialist self-help preachers. The preacher, pastor or priest still commands the social role and authority. You can tell by his nice car.
It's true tho that many of these hucksters DO claim a special pipeline to God. Many claim to be prophets, or to speak to god in a way normal people can't, this is classic shamanism.
>Shamans interpreted dreams and omens witnessed by ordinary people.
Amongst other things. Their primary role was to intercede on behalf of normal people with the spirits, something they were seen as uniquely capable of. Sure, any Grug might see a spirit while sleeping, but ONLY the shaman had the power to see such things whenever he wanted, and the authority to deal with such beings on behalf of the tribe.
>Today, parishioners are encouraged to participate in pastorship by having a whack at their own interpretations, but first the priest tells them that they are special and touched by the Holy Spirit -- essentially, that they must have the same powers.
It's not the same when ANYONE can do it. Shamanism is very specifically about having a class of people who specialize in dealing with and communing with the spirits, priests as a rule do NOT claim any special ability in this regard, tho ofc they claim they have superior ability to interpret such phenomena, as a result of their training or their purity."
;


if(Anonymous && title=="" && postNumber==5619598 && dateTime=="11/08/18(Thu)15:45:02")

">>5619595
>>5619553
>The spiritual power is more distributed, but it is still the priest's prerogative to distribute, confirm, and nurture that power.
If a priest claims such a power he is acting in a shamanic role, but few priests do make such a claim, they generally point to their holy texts as the source of their power, and will explain that while they might have been "chosen" for the job of being a priest, the actual power comes from God alone and is available to everyone. A shaman is really much closer to being a spiritualist medium, they claim a unique and superior ABILITY to commune with the spirits, not just a superior authority to interpret their wishes."
;


if(Anonymous && title=="" && postNumber==5619610 && dateTime=="11/08/18(Thu)15:46:42")

">>5619392
No most worshiped some kind of god"
;


if(Anonymous && title=="" && postNumber==5619658 && dateTime=="11/08/18(Thu)15:56:26")

">>5619491
Holy wars are monotheism only.
>>5619610
No most were animist, the black civilizations however were polytheistic."
;


if(Anonymous && title=="" && postNumber==5619678 && dateTime=="11/08/18(Thu)15:59:23")

">>5619658
>Holy wars are monotheism only.
That's really not true, although pagan holy wars tended to be smaller scale and directed towards other temples rather than being generalized."
;


if(Anonymous && title=="" && postNumber==5619710 && dateTime=="11/08/18(Thu)16:06:17")

">>5619595
>It's not the same when ANYONE can do it.
Of course it's a little different from one family line reserving a unique role through blood continuity or whatever. But the idea here is that it is STILL a unique power, the priest just tells as many people as he can that they ARE unique and have unique power. It's his power to identify and anoint people as having nascent power that they have to train and hone, by taking over responsibilities in the church on an unpaid basis, and also by paying him more. I'm sure that this isn't a very new idea. In fact I think it's probably a very old system.

It's still shamanism. But it's consumerist shamanism for a narcissistic age. In reality, the evangelical preacher or pastor derives his authority not from the divine, but from the congregation, by gaining their loyalty, by massaging their egos. Likewise, any primitive shaman would have to mostly tell people what they'd want to hear, or else their beliefs would change or they'd go somewhere else or they'd just defy him or her. At which point the shaman risks somebody getting away with not doing what they say, thereby hurting their credibility and security. Nihil nuovum sub sole. I don't believe that all that much has really changed in this business, because people really haven't changed as much as we like to think."
;


if(Anonymous && title=="" && postNumber==5619761 && dateTime=="11/08/18(Thu)16:19:09")

">>5619710
>Of course it's a little different from one family line reserving a unique role through blood continuity or whatever.
Shamanism was not always or even often a "family job", it generally required an apprenticeship to an existing shaman but really anyone could become one.

The difference between a shaman and a priest is purely as matter of the one claiming a unique ability to commune with the spirits, while the other merely claims a unique ability o interpret the spirits demands. It's subtle but it's important, shamanic peoples believe their shaman has a unique """genetic""" capacity for spiritual intercession, while priestly societies believe that anyone can be a priest, given teh right training."
;


if(Anonymous && title=="" && postNumber==5619776 && dateTime=="11/08/18(Thu)16:22:23")

">>5619761
I thought Priest were teachers of the ways of the deity not actually talking to it. They read the bible/quran/talmud then teach us the correct way to interpret the holy laws."
;


if(Anonymous && title=="" && postNumber==5619791 && dateTime=="11/08/18(Thu)16:25:21")

">>5619776
Yes exactly, their claim is to be be superior interpreters of the will of the spirits, they don't (often) claim superior ability to actually commune with the spirits directly. This is what shamen (and magicians) claim, and is the main difference between the two."
;


if(Anonymous && title=="" && postNumber==5620059 && dateTime=="11/08/18(Thu)17:32:54")

">>5619088
Are you retarded? Both Greek and Roman civilizations were polytheistic,hell;the olympics were made to pay homage to the gods"
;


if(Anonymous && title=="" && postNumber==5620118 && dateTime=="11/08/18(Thu)17:53:05")

">>5619791
This is also why animism is more sincerely spiritual than any Abrahamic religion, there's not that barrier there."
;


if(Anonymous && title=="" && postNumber==5620812 && dateTime=="11/08/18(Thu)21:39:01" && image=="aztec poetry.png")

">>5619023
>>5619055
>>5619088
>>5619097
>>5619097
>>5619354
>>5619293
>amerindians oonly had basic shamanism meme
>niggas don't know about how the Aztec invented spinozan philosophical metaphysics before Spinoza did

http://www.mexicolore.co.uk/aztecs/home/aztec-philosophy
https://www.iep.utm.edu/aztec/#H2
http://dailynous.com/2014/05/20/pip-1-huebner-interviews-maffie/

Wasn't just the Aztec, other Mesoamerican and Andean civilizations had actual cosmological philosophy and intellectual traditions/occupations in general"
;


if(Anonymous && title=="" && postNumber==5620918 && dateTime=="11/08/18(Thu)22:30:59")

">>5620812
This is different, Mesoamerica and the Andes were cradles of civilization with complex mythology, while the area corresponding to the US today was...not."
;


if(Anonymous && title=="" && postNumber==5620978 && dateTime=="11/08/18(Thu)22:56:30")

">>5619088
except no, that's not what spirits are at all. Fire spirits come out when fire is happening. Earth spirits come out when earth is happening. Same with water, air, or whatever spirits your infinite brain can conjure up."
;


if(Anonymous && title=="" && postNumber==5621030 && dateTime=="11/08/18(Thu)23:16:25" && image=="1448281907690.jpg")

"We badly need a separate board for religion and spirituality. The understanding of these concepts on this board is childlike.";


if(Anonymous && title=="" && postNumber==5622507 && dateTime=="11/09/18(Fri)10:13:01")

">>5621030
wojak looks slightly happy in that picture because his beard covers up the left side of his frown"
;


if(Anonymous && title=="" && postNumber==5622510 && dateTime=="11/09/18(Fri)10:13:51")

">>5618864
I mean obviously it evolved, I don't think you'd find Siberians with totems based on American animals"
;


if(Anonymous && title=="" && postNumber==5622516 && dateTime=="11/09/18(Fri)10:15:51")

">>5619055
>spirits and deities are absolutely different"
;


if(Anonymous && title=="" && postNumber==5622521 && dateTime=="11/09/18(Fri)10:17:08" && image=="mexican wave.png")

">>5619761
Okay, I'll buy that. But in addition to being a subtle distinction, I'd add that it's also often a blurry one.

>>5620812
Not everyone thinks of all American cultures as one monolothic group. There's a new story out on genetic research featuring our friend Dr. Reich."
;


if(Anonymous && title=="" && postNumber==5622524 && dateTime=="11/09/18(Fri)10:17:28")

">>5619370
>religion was invented for social control meme"
;


if(Anonymous && title=="" && postNumber==5622535 && dateTime=="11/09/18(Fri)10:19:49")

">>5619088
>what is the scientific revolution"
;


if(Anonymous && title=="" && postNumber==5622542 && dateTime=="11/09/18(Fri)10:21:23")

">>5622524
In many cases that's at least part of its purpose, with the other part of its purpose being a sense of connection to the sublime."
;


if(Anonymous && title=="" && postNumber==5622557 && dateTime=="11/09/18(Fri)10:24:14")

">>5620812
>thread is specifically about Amerindian shamanism
>HURR y u think dey only had shamen lmao dont u kno about aztecs DURR"
;


if(Anonymous && title=="" && postNumber==5622590 && dateTime=="11/09/18(Fri)10:33:46")

">>5622524
No, that's not why it was invented, but it lends itself to that purpose in a way animism doesn't."
;


if(Anonymous && title=="" && postNumber==5622658 && dateTime=="11/09/18(Fri)10:50:48")

">>5619097
>Most native Americans weren't actually shamanic at all, they were totemists or even full on polytheists.

Do you mind explaining the difference between shamanism and totemism here?"
;


if(Anonymous && title=="" && postNumber==5622679 && dateTime=="11/09/18(Fri)10:55:24")

">>5622658
Totemism is closer to being what we would recognize as a religion, it posits a tribal spirit who can be appeased and who looks over the whole tribe. Totemist societies are generally also shamanic, but they're clearly on a path to polytheism."
;


if(Anonymous && title=="" && postNumber==5622706 && dateTime=="11/09/18(Fri)11:03:10")

"Discussions like this are more or less moot, since they're the academic posturings over minute semantic distinctions relating to socio-spiritual phenomena that the people who genuinely buy into these socio-spiritual phenomena would dismiss these distinctions as pointless or irrelevant.

A native American tribesman from 1000 AD would recognise a Shinto priest from the same era would as being a holy man / medicine man / shaman, despite the superficial distinctions in degrees of organisation, social role, and so on. A genuine acceptance of the existence of Spirits renders the hollow scrutiny of atheistic scholars over the nature of relationship with these spirits useless."
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if(Anonymous && title=="" && postNumber==5622741 && dateTime=="11/09/18(Fri)11:18:41")

">>5622679
I have to admit, that seems a little reductionist. Do you really think the development of religion is such a linear progression?"
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if(Anonymous && title=="" && postNumber==5622761 && dateTime=="11/09/18(Fri)11:24:48")

">>5622741
It's pretty linear, yes. Ofc most peoples don;t develop their religion linearly, they adopt a religion from another people. But left to their own devices, the progression is pretty linear."
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if(Anonymous && title=="" && postNumber==5622803 && dateTime=="11/09/18(Fri)11:36:11")

">>5622761
According to whom? You?"
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if(Anonymous && title=="" && postNumber==5622843 && dateTime=="11/09/18(Fri)11:47:32")

">>5622803
If you care read up on it."
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if(Anonymous && title=="" && postNumber==5622918 && dateTime=="11/09/18(Fri)12:10:41" && image=="Immanuel_Kant_(painted_portrait).jpg")

">>5622679
>>5622761
>muh constructed categories"
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if(Anonymous && title=="" && postNumber==5622925 && dateTime=="11/09/18(Fri)12:13:41")

">>5622918
>HURR i r teh smart!
Good for you sweaty."
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if(Anonymous && title=="" && postNumber==5622956 && dateTime=="11/09/18(Fri)12:26:06")

"I think religions change based on socialorganization<->survivalmeans.

Hunter gatherers tended to be animist. Early agrarian societies also tend to share both shamanistic and animist religious customs.

Late agrarian societies tended to identify the sun, earth, river, sea, etc... deities as major agents of nature. The hierarchical importance appeared and it was ingrained in this societies as the religious authorities (shamans/priests) appeared. Chiefdoms and early states.

Polytheist cultures were simply cultures with a centralist enough state power to accomodate the conquered cultures' deities in their own pantheon. The religious strates of these societies marked the hierarchy of these gods.

There was interaction between these groups obviously, hence the variation in NorthAmerica."
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}
}