'https://www.scribd.com/document/551280851/Unfiltered

I think the first ten pages of this are finally pretty good. I can't really afford to work on this anymore because I gave it away for free, but let me know what you think';

'Oh my hovel,';

'>Imagine a heavy piece of iron being thrown at you at the speed of a steam locomotive. That's what his kicks feel like
I dunno, I thought it sounded like a cool metaphor, what do you think';

'>>23351133
>His kick hit like a locomotive.';

'>>23351076
that was crazy, anon. first of all I don’t think I’ve ever read a 35 page long scene like that, but I don’t really read screenplays. I will say that it read like a dream/cartoon which I assume you kind of intended. it had lots of great wordplay, banter, and jokes. I’m glad I read the whole thing.';

'>>23351076
I liked it until it became a batman fan fic. The first ten pages are pretty good, but everything really falls off around page 15.';

'>>23351279
>>23351068

Although I will say that for the first ten pages, and even some of the bits with Wayne, and the Detectives later you've got a very powerful, unique voice, which I like quite a lot. Have you written anything else?';

'>>23351291
Only ghostwriting, nothing with my name on it. I made some cuts but now I think the script is too short, it has to be exactly an hour long for story reasons. I was working on it since before the Joker movie came out, so I was really bummed when some of my ideas were used';

'>>23351174
nta, that works but isn't it too brief? Where's the poetry?';

'>>23351320
poetry is brief.';

'fuck you';

'>The thirty foot wide canal became a blinding white sheet as the sun reflected across the water's surface.
>The sun reflecting across the water's surface turned the thirty foot wide canal into a blinding white sheet.

Which one do you pros prefer?';

'>>23351068
Finished writing my story, got 100k words but now not too sure on the editing process. I've completely deleted 4 chapters/12k words to rewrite but other than that don't know what else to look out for';

'>>23351463
Make the sentences sleek and sexy by taking out fluff words.';

'>>23351416
Second. But I guess it depends if you want to focus more on the canal itself than the weather.';

'>>23351416
>Sun rays skip over the waters of the thirty foot wide canal, capped with a swirling sheen of of blinding white light
Too poetic?';

'after a couple of weeks (almost 2 months) of my brain being kaput, i've finally come up with new ideas to continue my story with
feels like i was injected with bliss';

'Should every sentence flow into the next one?
>The applicant has 10 yrs of HR experience. She will bring valuable new perspectives to our team because of this background.
vs
>The applicant has 10 yrs of HR experience. Based on this background, she will bring valuable new perspectives to our team.

If every sentence read like this, there would be no way to set up tension that you can pay off, say, in another paragraph. It would make for a very boring read to have every vague and incomplete idea explained in the consecutive sentence.';

'>>23351885
When you're describing job applications I'm not sure that you need to prioritize tension.
In both of these the second sentence refers back to the first one, but version 1 does it at the end while version 2 does it at the start. Doing it at the start seems better because it makes it easier for my brain to resolve the referent of "this background". This is almost a grammatical issue. I might prefer a version where you completely omitted "because of this background" over version 1 (but version 2 is still better).
Maybe a different example would be better? Is this the kind of writing you want to apply it to? Highly practical/informative text is usually read differently';

'>>23351938
This isn't my example, its something i lifted off of youtube on someone else's creative writing course. Some of this youtube writing advice i've noticed doesn't apply well enough over the entire text. It's only to be applied sparingly.

>He careened off into the woods, machete and axe in tow. He had remembered something his mother used to say when he was young and smiled to himself; maybe this wasn't so bad afterall. In spite of the sun, the thicket got darker as he approached, as if to delay his pursuit, the gods conspiring with nature against him.

This paragraph, you might argue has no flow compared to the first i posted and yet I am setting up tension to pay it off in the next paragraph, or chapter. This is why writing advice is often so fucking cryptic and often unnecessary because it is taken in the context that it has to apply everywhere regardless of the writers purpose.';

'>Finish first draft (probably 2 more months of writing at my current speed)
>Finish first third of the story (probably will be done in about 1 week since I'm on vacation), polish it up, make sure it's satisfactory, send it around to get some feedbacks, then come back fresh to the first draft

What would you do? I'm partial to the first option. I can definitely see room for improvements in what I'm writing but at the same time I'll probably change my minds on some thing when I get to actually writing them, so I'll need to go back and edit things. I'd rather get it all out now.';

'>>23351279
all fiction is batman fanfiction, he's just offscreen in his cave';

'>>23352114
"If you do X then Y happens" tends to be better than hard prescriptions, yeah.
The flow of that passage is OK but the details are off. I'm gonna nitpick a bit.
>in tow
This specifically means you're pulling something along, not just that you're carrying it. Makes me imagine he's pulling a cart or something.
>He had remembered
This is past perfect tense while the rest of the passage is past tense. It should probably be past tense as well, currently it reads as though he remembered it before entering the woods.
>In spite of the sun, the thicket got darker as he approached
It's relative, right? That'd happen even if there were more sun or less sun. Contrasting the sun with the dark is fine but you need to go about it slightly differently.';

'>>23351885
I like sentence 2 better. The first one is just "she has this, she will that" very factual and clinical, while the second one breaks up that flow and sounds more interesting.';

'>>23351885
>>The applicant has 10 yrs of HR experience. She will bring valuable new perspectives to our team because of this background.

>The applicant has 10 yrs of HR experience, bringing valuable new perspectives to our team.

I don't even see why you would have two different sentences.';

'>>23351885
>"With ten years' HR experience, she will bring valuable new perspectives to our team," thought Mark as he eyed the applicant's tight black miniskirt.';

'>>23352198
Option 2. If feedback unanimously says you have some serious problems you need to fix then the 2 months you spent writing the rest of the draft will be wasted since you'll just have to re-do it, probably from scratch, anyway. Plus you'll get your feedback a lot faster and can use it to plan or restructure the rest of your draft sooner.';

'>>23352848
This is exactly why I talked about context and tension. In tow may also mean accompaniment--he is not alone in this dangerous journey-- and not necessarily pulling or following. Yes he had remembered that before, that's precisely what motivates him into the woods. Also, the inclusion of gods and nature is meant to show that the despite the sun shining--it being midday--the thicket is still darkening, unnaturally of course.';

'>>23351416
If it's an adjective as strong as "blinding" then you should include your character in the sentence.';

'>>23353062
>In tow may also mean accompaniment--he is not alone in this dangerous journey-- and not necessarily pulling or following.
This is by metaphor with the literal meaning. When you use it for people it adds an involuntary flavor to it, person B is going along with person A wherever person A goes without any personal agency in the matter.
If you use it in the literal sense it has to be literally true. If you use it in the figurative sense then you're bringing in that flavor which is unnecessary because it's fully implied by the kinds of objects they are.
To get the flavor of accompaniment you could just say "accompanied by".
>Yes he had remembered that before, that's precisely what motivates him into the woods.
In that case, is "and smiled to himself" etcetera supposed to be past tense or past perfect? I'm finding it confusing.
>Also, the inclusion of gods and nature is meant to show that the despite the sun shining--it being midday--the thicket is still darkening, unnaturally of course.
I assumed he was passing into denser vegetation and things got darker for that reason.';

'My chapters are only about 1500 words long. I fear that's too short. But I don't want to pad them with meaningless text.';

'>>23351599
>>Sun rays skip over the waters of the thirty foot wide canal, capped with a swirling sheen of of blinding white light
>Too poetic?

No, too wordy.';

'>>23351416
I would say the first, because it starts with the immediate sense impression.

(I would also replace 'thirty foot wide' with just 'broad' unless your story is about the logistics of bridging canals.)

>>23351599
Careful, brother, you're absorbing the ChatGPT prose style.';

'>>23352198

I would go with first option, because you really have to get the whole story out to get the big picture and see what needs to change at a structural level. At an early stage of writing, you will still be your own best critic. The rough draft will definitely look like shit to you. No need to ask anybody else about it.

>>23351416
I would go with the second option but I don't see why you have to mention the exact width of the canal. If you're going to do it, make sure you use hyphens. thirty-foot-wide

Problem with the first option is it places way too much emphasis on the exact width of the canal as if anybody cares that it's "thirty foot wide." It's almost like you're trying to sell a car or something. "The thirty-foot-wide windshield..."';

'>>23353511
>I would also replace 'thirty foot wide' with just 'broad' unless your story is about the logistics of bridging canals
>>23353516
>it places way too much emphasis on the exact width of the canal as if anybody cares that it's "thirty foot wide."
Good points, thanks. I was trying to paint the scene but I didn't realize how unnecessary it was.';

'>>23351266
I think it needs more settings. We're in the parking lot too long. Anyone have any idea how we can break it up more? Wayne and Carly need to go to a place within walking distance to discuss Julian's injury, but it's night and everything would be closed. Also, I need another five or six minutes';

'>>23354012
we also can't have any cuts in time because Wayne is checking his watch for the wedding which is actually in an hour, the length of the script';

'does anyone else find no feedback to be even worse than negative feedback?';

'>>23354296
Yes. Apathy is worse than anger when it comes to reactions to my writing.';

'>>23354296
I sent a few chapters to a friend a week ago. I haven't heard a thing since. Either they've not read it yet or it was just so god awful they can't bring themselves to call me and tell me. I just want an answer.';

'>go back to read over a first draft from last year
>the dialogue is so cringe I want to die';

'>>23354296
Everything I post on this godforsaken website gets one of four responses
>"This is PERFECT! No notes! Now go make more"
>"You formatted this in a way I don't like and therefore I refuse to engage with it on principle"
>"What the fuck? You are a danger to society and you need to be put down ASAP so you don't immanentize the eschaton"
>total silence
Silence is the most common but I have learned that the same thing can get literally all of these responses depending on who happens to see it that day';

'I don't really go on /lit/ so I have been using the wrong general for days without knowing and someone just informed me.
Except I have been writing post by post and this general says limit excerpts to one post and I am just writing and posting, not editing or proofreading (at all).
So this is not actually the right general.
Where is the general where I just write mid quality niche erotica directly in the quick reply box until character limit, post, then repeat while linking each previous post?';

'>>23354469
Probably some thread in /trash/. this one is for talking about the craft, or at the most, critique, not spamming your shitty erotica just cuz.

Godspeed though. At least you actually write unlike 80% of this thread.';

'Anons I'm losing my mind because I can't decide between writing something I'm passionate about or writing something with the purpose of having it published/for popularity. What should I do? I want to make money but also want to just write what I like. I'm going crazy';

'>>23354478
It's unlike 99% of /wwoym/ but apparently that is still not what that thread is for
Will mods ban me if I just make my own thread for people to directly write-by-post in?
Honestly I stopped writing almost completely a decade or so ago and just decided to start again on a whim because I misunderstood /wwoym/
But it's weird that people would be reserved and sparse about writing on /lit/, like who cares if a dozen or a hundred spergs on 4chan don't like your writing
>>23354489
I just stopped writing completely when I got to that dilemma so I don't know lol';

'>>23354489
you won’t get published or make any money, so just write what you like.';

'Pastebin won't let me post anything it deems "offensive" and I have zero idea what part of my writing it doesn't like. Is there an alternative 4chan allows? I know it won't let me post a 0bin.';

'Is the purpose of University nowadays just solely for Connections? can you get the same quality of education by yourself in today's age?';

'>>23354538
Just take a screenshot and post it, if it's not egregiously long.';

'these threads are just a bunch of samefags jerking each other off.';

'>>23354538
i've seen anons use https://pastes.io/ instead
>>23354554
then what is your reason for being here, seether?';

'>>23354643
Thanks anon. text.is worked for me for now (I removed the http) so I'll keep this one in mind as a backup if something goes wrong with it';

'>>23354554
who is samefagging';

'Is it dumb to use a note app on my phone and type some brief ideas or sentences when I am in the mood? does anyone else do this or do you keep your phone strictly separate from writing?';

'I've been writing a bit about this idea
>a guy has been a simp for a woman for years, she tricks him into removing a stone in a tomb to get a treasure, but he is cursed after he does so and is left for dead
>the guy has to remove the curse before it is to late and to do so he has to get the treasure, so he pursues the woman
>however, the woman is now traveling with her lover, unknown to the guy, who is still simping for her
I'm wondering, would it be a good idea to swap the gender of the characters, i.e. making the simp a woman (female)? This idea came to me because I've meet two women who were in a relationship where they were madly in love with someone to the point they acted like retards. This could also help me bring some public because apparently women love that, but I'm not sure.';

'Is it harder for you guys to write in 3rd person or 1st person? And why?

I'm curious on what you anons think since I'm conflicted between the two.';

'>>23354727
I prefer 3rd but neither is difficult. Sometimes I am tempted to write in second person out of simple misanthropy.';

'>self-insert character has to talk to a girl he doesn't know
>no idea how to write this since I've never done it

Writing is hard :(';

'>>23354489
If you write for passion, you get at least one thing you want, and there's no reason why it couldn't get popular too.
If you write solely for popularity, you will get garbage you're ashamed of, and which might not get popular either. So a giant waste of time.';

'>Writing some stuff for my story every day
>Fantasy genre, bit dark but generally hopeful, indomitable human spirit yadda yadda yadda
>Get an intrusive thought about a sci-fi concept
>Real bleak stuff, probably wouldn't be out of place in a Black Mirror episode
>I fucking hate Black Mirror btw, I was forced to watch one episode in Uni and cringed the whole time
>Still seriously considering turning the concept into a short novella, probably 10k words at best, in case I can send it round short stories tournaments and maybe get my name out there
Viability of this pro gamer move, anons ?';

'"Highway 1 you mean. 101 cuts through Salinas. I'm more west, near Monterey."

Is it alright to start the second sentence with a number like that? I don't want to repeat the word highway and I definitely don't want to type out One-Oh-One because that looks stupid.';

'I had a dream, perhaps a nightmare, and so I decided to write one part of it.
It's the first time in a little while that I've felt that strong compulsion which would deny my a return to sleep until I wrote it out of my head.
https://pastebin.com/WuAJmeE1';

'>>23354700
I don't do it myself, since I keep mental notes and I keep refining them down until I either discard them or I write them into my story.
But note taking isn't a bad idea, and I don't think it matters if it's one your phone or not.';

'>>23354700
I use a paper pad so if I'm out and an idea or sentence comes I'll write it down. Same thing I guess.';

'>>23353149
What is the rule with changing tenses anyway I could expand the thicket part using present tense and it wouldn't be a problem.

>He careened off into the woods, machete and axe in tow. He had remembered something his mother used to say when he was young and had smiled to himself; maybe this wasn't so bad after all. In spite of the sun, the thicket got darker as he approached--the branches forming a roof over his head, the grass beneath carpeting his very footsteps and the trunks closing into him--as if to delay his pursuit, or perhaps the gods conspiring with nature to welcome him.';

'>>23351068
It’s very short but what do you think I can improve in this snippet? I think I made it too boring, I’m equally concerned about advice on rewriting it to be better, but also can I ask what first impressions you had?

>The Thermal Imaging Compository Satellite, called the Onyx, finished its bi-hourly pass over Oured at 05:35z. Antenne scattered across its surface had received thousands of thermal scans, each one taken from an individual satellite across Osteria in the 2 hours since its last rotation. These thousands of scans, when combined, composed a staggering 100 petabytes of information, and the Onyx had to combine all of them into a singular scan. Her dual supercomputers, powerful as they were, had taken the entirety of her rotation to this, but had given the Office of Naval Intelligence an invaluable piece of information. A complete infrared scan of the milky way, showing every ship that had radiated, burned, or made even a degrees difference in heat, exactly 2 hours ago.';

'>>23351068
He walked down the street and saw the dog. The dog was on a chain, and the chain was wrapped around a fire hydrant, and the hydrant was spewing water, and the waifs were splashing in the puddles. Introduce villain. . . . The dog was a pitbull. The pitbull was panting from heat, pink tongue sagging, dry, and cracked. It ate a waif whole! One bite! Barely even swallowed! Just took it up into its gullet like a stork! Ah, the stork in reverse: the pitbull, taker of children! Anywho. . . . Yep, he walked down the street and saw the dog and saw the waif and then saw only the dog and the waif’s empty shoes. No more wet waif to see. Dog lies down and woofs into its folded paws and falls asleep. He walks down the street. I hate the city, he thinks.';

'>>23351068
Is my prose good enough? I finished a quick short story. You don't need to read the whole thing, I just want to hear your thoughts on it, like pointing out weak points and stuff
https://pastebin.com/BYCU0prC';

'>>23354489
3rd option: write to be the best';

'>>23354862
>What is the rule with changing tenses anyway
The action of your story takes place in one particular tense, typically past tense. Other tenses have meanings relative to that one. For beginners the most common problem is mixing past tense and present tense for no reason.
This version is grammatically still iffy, even "maybe this wasn't so bad after all" should probably be past perfect, since it's part of the smiling to himself(?)
But I think you're much better off scrapping the use of past perfect tense. If this took place right before he dove into the thicket then you could just narrate it right before you narrate the diving into the thicket. Or if you want to keep it in this part of the narration, just turn all of it past tense, which makes it almost concurrent with the setting off.
Even when this kind of chronological jumping around is grammatically sound it can be a burden for the reader who has to spend precious brain cycles figuring this out instead of getting absorbed into the parts you want them to care about.

>>23354875
It's dry but that's fine at this length, it suits the content. If you follow it up with something more lively then that creates a pleasant contrast.
Nitpicks:
- You switch from "it" to "her" midway through
- "Antenne" -> "Antennae"
- "had given" -> "now gave"/"could now give"/&c, this moment has caught up with the action.

>>23354926
Good stuff, strong style.
Nitpicks:
- "was spewing", "were splashing", "was panting" would all be stronger as active verbs I think, even if that means losing the repetition.
- "waif" didn't make me assume "child". Maybe the context should've made it clear but the tone made me receptive to other possibilities. Maybe it's because I'm ESL and the Dutch word "wijf" interfered. Somebody else should weigh in.
- "No more wet waif to see"—earlier you said there were multiple. Maybe it should be just the one, or you should describe the others' reactions (or lack thereof).
- I'm unsure about the transition from past to present tense. It's uncommon enough that it may be too jarring to be worth it.

>>23354984
It's good. There are wrinkles, but I think you just need to edit more. Feels like you know what you're doing. I read it to the end.
Some comments (not exhaustive):
- I'd use "I" in the first paragraph rather than "you" since the rest of the story uses very subjective narration.
- "cold and clinical bed"—"clinical" doesn't quite fit. This makes me want to compare it to cold and clinical speech but that doesn't work.
- "I'd swing the door open" -> "I'll swing the door open"
- Your indentation looks inconsistent.
- "Snatching [...], I carried"—this means he snatches it while carrying it.
- "When I made it back though"—what does "though" do here?
- "The world had changed a lot more [...]"—this paragraph feels too much like it's from her perspective rather than him relaying hers.
- "I’ve never heard her laugh before" -> "I never heard her laugh before"
- "in front of it" -> "in front of them"';

'>>23355197
You didn't read the present tense part.';

'>>23355197
Also the smiling part is what the mother said, it would be weird to say:
>maybe this hadn't been so bad after all
as it takes away from the meaning. Maybe I should replace the semicolon with a colon.';

'>>23354489
Why not do both? Do you only have time for one of them, or something?
>>23354700
Of course you should make notes when you're out and about. I've lost ideas by not writing them down when I had them.';

'>>23354777
yes it’s fine.';

'>>23354751
Write what you know, or gain the life experience it takes to write what you want. Successful writers tend to be people who live interesting lives, not basement dwellers.';

'>>23355492
Can you elaborate?

>>23355542
If it's a literal quotation then I'm guessing it should be present tense. The colon sounds like a good idea, and I'd recommend adding quotation marks as well for minimal friction.
If it's a paraphrase then it should have the tense of its context, in this case past perfect. (But again, I recommend dropping the past perfect and shuffling things around.)';

'>>23354862
>>23355492
Oh, now I get what you mean. Sorry for skipping over that, I read the addition (which I thought was fine) but didn't understand your comment. That expansion uses a present participle, which is relative to the main verb (in this case I think that would be "got darker"). I found a nice explanation on Reddit: https://old.reddit.com/r/writing/comments/rxs6rx/mixing_past_and_present_participles/hrkbnuk/
Key example:
>Turning the corner, I finally came face-to-face with the thief.
"Turning the corner" takes place at the same time as "came face-to-face". So it's still all in the past.
So this doesn't end up being a change of tense, at least not in that way. You're still narrating things as if they took place in the past.';

'>>23355628
The present continuous tense describing the thicket?';

'>>23355670
For the present continuous you also need a present tense of "to be". You only have a present participle which is not enough to move the whole thing into the present tense.';

'>>23355691
I don't get you, first you say its ok here >>23355669
then you say i need present tense?';

'>>23355728
It's not the present continuous. If it were the present continuous then that would be bad. By "need" I didn't mean that you should do it.
Present continuous would be like this:
>the branches are forming a roof over his head [...]
The word "are" moves it into the present tense. But you don't have that, so you're good. The participle is instead linked to "got darker", which is past tense.';

'Rambles specifically prohibited or allowed to post? I have a writing thing to complain about, but I do realize that could be annoying for the thread and so I am stopping myself.
I would say it could be asking for advice, but I don't think what's on my mind could realistically be given advice to.

/crit/ as well would maybe better for that however jugding from the last reply it would be akin to negromancy and thus unfruitful.';

'>>23355752
Go for it.';

'>>23355752
>>23355790
I am soon to complete 3 chapters with a prologue of my webnovel and actually publish this start of my webnovel.

It's a fantasy about newly emerged continent in war striven world, written in 3rd omniscient perspective following multiple protagonists.

I plan out most if not everything (although that is practically impossible) and I encountered problem with the multiple protagonists, I can't even explain it with any other sentence than the level of "soul" they have.

Main villain is lighning in the bottle. Practically too good compared to the rest of characters. Every single moment I have in mind captures *that feeling* of a piece of art that deeply engraves itself into your heart in emotional aspect, has no filler with Chekhov's gun used everywhere.involved with him. He has the best fights, dramatic scenes, theme and endings.
(Of course I am shittengly hyping something up that is mere ramble but please suspense yourself enough to assume this is correct to understand this perspective for a moment).

The problem arises with other characters especially other independent protagonists.
The main protagonist which will take most 'screen' time of the the webnovel, there's a lot of autistically cool things I want to encapture in his side but it's a lot of "all flash, no substance" when a satisfying ending for his story, especially compared main villain because main villain is a subplot enriching the world, not the protagonist's story.
Main protagonist's clique has a major fight with unrelated minor villain but it doesn't live to thematic power of the subplot's one.
Another heavily focused on character has scenes on par with main villain but doesn't have that much of an ending living up to it.

That's generally the thing bugging my mind right now.
If someone bothers to read this and is interested in the aspects of my story I can expand a little detail on it. Although not outright connections to the release as having my work being associated with proof to 4channel might be not the brightest idea due to how gay modern world is.
I did however asked for advice for it few times here.';

'>>23355969
>war striven
War riven! You mean riven.

Good luck with the web novel, it sounds promising.';

'>>23355986
>War riven! You mean riven.
I'm sorry, I am an ESL which has MAYBE native level understand of English, or at least higher than my native thanks to being raised with internet Yes, I am very young
>Good luck with the web novel, it sounds promising.
Thank you very much.';

'>>23356023
>understand
*ing
for fuck's sake...';

'>>23354984
Start with the "Normally, when people my age kick the bucket..." paragraph';

'>>23354534
>you won't get published or make any money
it's unlikely, sure, but there's anons literally in the last few threads talking about how they make a living writing so why are you saying it like it's 1 in a million if even retard 4channers are doing it';

'Too lazy to convert to digital at the moment, but how's this introduction so far? Or is it too early to tell?';

'My story is titled "Hot Chihuahua Sex in a Can" and it's about a Mexican prostitute who seduces her prey in an elevator and rigs it to stop when it's time to do business.';

'>>23356420
I hope she doesn't tell her clients the elevator is rigged to stop, half the fun is not knowing when it'll get back to working.';

'>>23356308
it is literally one in a million';

'>>23356455
good thing i'm more talented than 999999 doomed retards like you';

'How many published books do you need to make a living off of from passive income?';

'>>23356550
Depends on how well they sell
Enormous differences there';

'>>23356550
If you aren't self-published you get about 10% of the total book sales, so like... A dollar, dollar and a half.
I'm not familiar with american tax system but I think 30k a year is probably enough for a decent living, so like 30-20k books a year.';

'>>23356580
$30k/yr. won't even pay for apartment rent in most cities. The only way a writer can make money these days is to sell the TV/movie rights. Trying to make it from book sales is nearly impossible.';

'>>23356637
Most professional writers make their living from teaching at a university. Only a tiny minority of published authors can live off their work--whether book sales or movie deals.';

'>>23356637
>>23356653
Damn that's depressing. I just figured if you hit the best seller list you're ready to retire.';

'Struggling a bit to write the first real action scene of my story. It's the first one so I'm trying to not blow my load early on, and I'm thinking about a chase scene, where the protagonists run and eventually catch up with... someone, who give them valuable information later. But I'm struggling a bit on some things so I'll rant here
>Length: I'd like the chapter to be very action-focused, and I'm planning about 4k words for it, but I can't write a single chase over 4k words, it would be too slow. I will probably break it up with a chase, then a standoff, and eventually a capture.
>Reason: Still not completely sure how I want the whole thing to start. Either the chased reveal himself accidentally and book it or the protagonists figure him out and he gets spooked. Probably will go with the second one because I think it fits a tiny bit better.
>Threat: Probably won't go with anything more dangerous than a gun, but I dunno, I can't shake the feeling it would be simply inelegant. On the other hand it's a surefire way to show someone is dangerous and potentially unstable.';

'Can I ask what you think of my first page? Feel free to murder me, I can take it. I just want to know if it's something you'd continue reading or if it's melodramatic slop:


After five silent minutes of glaring at her like it’ll give me the heat vision I need to blast her head open, Zara says, “Quincy, you need to take that shit down.”

‘That shit’ she’s referring to means the article I published on my blog a few days back. The surprise viral hit propelling my name from obscure freelance journalist to kind of recognized name within smaller tech circles.

“And I’d do that, why?” I ask, cradling my cocktail, letting the condensation cool my flaming fingers. “So you can crawl back on your high horse and ignore the risks your inventions carry?”

“There’s always risk with technological advancements, asshat. Taking those risks is why we’re not going ‘ooga-booga’ in a cave right now.”

I’ve seen this story a hundred times. The same tired argument, the same justification when I questioned her ethics before. Before, when I believed in her, in the naive notion that progress didn’t have to come at the cost of human well-being. Before, when I saw who I thought was the love of my life.

But those don’t ever last long, do they?

Now, all I see is a stranger, someone I barely recognize. She’s not the picture of the smiling woman that has been my laptop wallpaper for so, so, SO long. Just a bad imitation in a bad dream.

I ask, “How many?” The sounds that make up her name die on my tongue, acid burning all the way down as I try to invoke it. “How many people were hurt from your latest gadget? How many were blinded or paralyzed?”

She doesn’t respond, but the death glare is answer enough.

“How. Many?”

“Does it matter?” She gives a shrug. A fucking shrug. What happened to her? “They can get cybernetics to fix it; they’ll even be compensated by Lorne Industries. Sounds like a free upgrade if you ask me.”

“An upgrade.”

“Yes, Quincy, an upgrade. Is that too complicated a word for you?”

“It’s not an upgrade if they never asked for it. You’re actually okay with that? Not even the tiniest remorse?”

“I sold the patent, making it #NotMyProblem. If I'm supposed to feel bad, I don't. I’m just the girl delivering the future, it’s not my responsibility if people are too stupid to use it right.”

“When did you become such a witch?”

“When did you become such a bleeding heart?”';

'how do I know if I’m writing rightly?';

'>>23356696
Why are you aiming for a specific wordcount for the chapter? To me that sounds like you're stretching a scene to have more words than it has actual content. And more than that, "long" and "action-focused" don't go together at all. Detail is the enemy of strong action scenes. The few ones I actually read (and didn't skip) knew as much, which is why they wrote in bursts of words rather than complete sentences and didn't overstay their welcome, lasting maybe a page or two.
>Legs burning. Lungs on fire. No time to look back. Just keep. Moving. Forward.
Enter late, leave early. This is a screenwriter's mantra but for action scenes in novels I think the advice applies too.';

'>>23356721
Eliminate the tag in the first sentence and just start with the dialog line.

Drop the second paragraph entirely, skipping to "I'd do that, why?

delete “So you can crawl back on your high horse and ignore the risks your inventions carry?”

because the high-horse bit is cheesey and the rest of it is stated or implied in the scene

>“When did you become such a witch?”

what are you in fifth grade? don't mince words. call her a bitch';

'There seems to be a growing trend toward minimalist writing. You'd open Dickens and see him take two paragraphs to describe a turkey dinner. Now you see editors telling you to trim it to half a sentence and move on with the plot. Where has the poetry gone? It's supposed to be creative writing but it's turning more and more clinical and flat.';

'>>23356824
>You'd open Dickens and see him take two paragraphs to describe a turkey dinner.
I'm glad that shit's not tolerated anymore because Jesus shit some authors really can't use 10 words when 100 will do.
>Where has the poetry gone?
There's nothing poetic about being verbose. Any monkey can talk a lot. True poetry -- and where the real skill lies -- is conveying the most meaning with the least words. If you're going to expand on description, save it for content that actually matters, like a character's emotions or thought process, which are too abstract to summarize in one sentence.';

'>>23356813
I appreciate the line edits, but they're not what I'm looking for right now, anon. I'm more curious if you found the conflict in the scene interesting.';

'>>23356721
"Smaller tech circles" -> How about "niche tech circles"?

"Why would I do that" sounds better than "I'd do that, why" imo.

People don't crawl onto a high horse, they climb.

To many "so"s. Just one, no caps. Consider "so very long" if you want to emphasis it.

Don't be cute with the hashtag. Reminds me of cringe Diablo Cody twenty aughts writing. Just say "not my problem".

Overall, this is very good. Snappy, realistic voice and intriguing subject matter. Perfect tempo between character exposition and plot reveal.';

'>>23356864
>Overall, this is very good. Snappy, realistic voice and intriguing subject matter. Perfect tempo between character exposition and plot reveal.
Thank you, kindly. It's good to know that the heart of the scene is good, the technical bits can easily be fixed.';

'>>23356672
Many famous best seller lists are arbitrarily chosen by editorial boards and as most books even put out by major publishers with distribution sell far less than 1 thousand copies. Many indy writers who sell "a lot" are burning a ton of their income on marketing and probably just trying to sell you their course.

Very few people buy books, few of those buy new books. Write for fun and with a hope of making a few bucks, but it is not an easy way to make a living.';

'>>23356455
it is literally not. there are multiple people who post to this very thread who make a living, so while it might be rare, it's probably more like 1 in 50 dedicated authors (people who actually give it their full attention, write for market, and try-hard)

>>23356580
authors can also live anywhere, including low COL areas. or even overseas. of course that depends on personal preferences and life circumstances on whether you actually can or want to move, but 30k in suburban ohio is enough to live on (if frugally). But if writing is all you want to do above everything, then it works';

'>>23356653
If you're teaching at a university, you need to have a Ph.D., and that's hella expensive. Do you really think a "professional writer" is going to make enough selling books to pay off their student loans, much less live? Writing fiction is a hobby for the employed, retired, or rich.
>>23356672
The odds of hitting the "best seller" list is infinitesimal.';

'>normie asks me if I should write a book about astronauts when I've never "lived that life"

Did she just destroy my entire writing aspiration? Should I only write about life experiences I've lived?';

'>>23356977
If you let a comment that stupid affect you, you probably never really had one';

'>>23356977
>she
>allowing some retard thot who couldn't tell you how she would feel if she didn't eat breakfast yesterday to question writing which inherently requires the ability to mentally generate and transcribe a scenario you may not ever have been in based on researching from other people who have';

'>>23356721
Honest effort, so honest critique.

There are a lot of amateurisms here. You're using dialogue to move the plot. Then you use dialogue to repeat the same beat instead of complicating it. There's nothing at stake so there's nothing that builds to a climax. It's just two characters lobbing exposition at each other.

There's some suspense but you pay it off too early and too directly. The pleasure of literature is autonomy on the page, letting the reader figure things out for themselves. The other pleasure is the occasional surprise when the reader turns out to be wrong. This the essence of "show, don't tell". If this is a first draft, fine. The first draft is usually filled with telling because you're figuring out the story for yourself. In subsequent drafts you have to start thinking about the reader.

Here are a couple of tricks that might be applicable here:

1. Instead of putting exposition in dialogue (which always sounds awkward--try imagining actors in a movie or play saying these lines; you'd walk out of the theatre) put it in internal monologue or flashback.
2. Make your dialogue more oblique. Don't just have characters respond 1-for-1 to what the other character says. Make them digress, interrupt, change topic, deflect, use sarcasm or other figures of speech.
3. Put your characters between a rock and a hard place, not just a rock. They both want something but there's nothing at hazard here. It's probably clear in your head, but you need to put that on the page for the reader otherwise they won't care.
4. Make everything more specific. You're relying too heavily on abstractions and generalities. It's first draft scaffolding that needs to replaced.

Here's a quick rewrite of just the dialogue:

"I want you to take it down."

"Why?"

"Because people are starting to talk. Because two of my private contracts are up for renewal and I'm out of grant funding. Because I'm asking. As your friend, as someone you once lov--"

"I'm just telling people about the risks."

“There’s always risks with technological advancements, asshat. Taking those risks is why we’re not going ‘ooga-booga’ in a cave right now.”

"Is that what you told them?"

"Who?"

"The thirteen people who went blind. Or the four who lost all motor function below their bellybutton."

"Ah yes, the old 'Oppenheimer was responsible for Hiroshima' argument. I sold a patent, Quincy. I didn't put a gun to anyone's head. Am I supposed to be held responsible for every stupid thing someone does with my inventions? Why don't we put Nokia on trial for terrorism while we're at it? And anyway, I heard Lorne's hooking them up with cybernetics. And a not insubstantial sum for signing the NDA."

"No remorse. Unbelievable."

"It's an upgrade if you ask me."

"When did you become such a bitch?"

"Probably around the same time you started getting your period."';

'I'm struggling to find words again. I want to include thermopolia in my setting because I like fast food and it helps me relate to my characters more to show them eating out. But would readers not appreciate me including what are stereotypically considered "modern" conveniences?';

'>>23356935
>Do you really think a "professional writer" is going to make enough selling books to pay off their student loans, much less live
No... which is why they teach at a university. Are you retarded or just illterate?';

'>>23356721
>After five silent minutes of glaring at her like it’ll give me the heat vision I need to blast her head open
Yeah the tone you set with this is aggression from the narrator and I don't know why he's been glaring at her for five silent minutes. Are these two people just sitting silently staring at one another while the guy is giving her the hot look of anger? As I'm coming into your story I'm immediately hitched up on trying to picture the scene I'm coming into here. My best divination is that he's staring at her while she's reading the article.

Is this a first page of a short story, or a novel? If it's a novel I'd recc taking it back as step from this starting point. You could even start your novel with the article itself leading the first chapter to give context to the setting and what's kicking off the story.';

'>>23356935
Don't know who that woman is. Is she reputable?

>>23356580
>If you aren't self-published you get about 10% of the total book sales, so like... A dollar, dollar and a half.
Not saying you're wrong, but I find it hard to believe. Who would ever agree to such a shitty deal? How do these publishing companies stay in business once word gets out they're screwing you so bad?';

'how do i know if my book is any good if nobody wants to read it or critique it?';

'>To his back a wall of pruned junipers fenced off an orchard, while before him lie endless acres of agricultural meadows. A haggard house with a bare maple tree dominating its front yard housed the farm's owners.

Any tips on how to spice up this description? The junipers and maple are important for later, so that has to stay. But I'm just trying to paint the picture of a rural road, a farmhouse, and miles of fields beyond it.';

'>>23357129
Second half is a bit of a garden path sentence
I would never describe something as "agricultural" if I'm looking for vibrant imagery
What is an agricultural meadow anyway? Aren't meadows wild by definition?';

'>>23357129
Description is a reflection of your intended tone and the context of the story. It should always be coupled with a particular point of view at a particular time. A man who was recently released from prison returning home requires a different description than a man who just lost his job in a humiliating confrontation, even if you're describing the same juniper trees.

Anyway, you're mixing tenses straight from the first sentence which is a more fundamental error.';

'>>23357129
Why do you want it to be spiced up? Why can’t you just say something direct and economical like ‘a rural road, a farmhouse, and miles of field beyond it’ and get on with what’s interesting in your story? I would only go into more detail here if it added to the mood I was building up (e.g. haunting and oppressive dereliction), or illuminated the character’s state of mind (e.g. enjoying the freedom of wide-open country), so as I don’t know the mood you’re going for or who your characters are, I can’t really give a helpful suggestion.';

'>>23357097
You despair like I do. My old beta reader became really lazy and stopped caring about what I put out, and I don't know anyone else who'd be able to tolerate my content and critique it. My only choice is to rely on the man in the mirror and hope I don't have any embarrassing typos or continuity errors.';

'>>23357179
>Anyway, you're mixing tenses straight from the first sentence which is a more fundamental error.
nta but what's the issue? Isn't it like describing a fight saying "He punched the first guy unconscious while still holding the second attacker at arm's length?" Action A is completed / past tense, but action B is still ongoing.';

'Is this anything, or is it just sophomoric edgelord trash?';

'>>23357232
Just fine I think, maybe rework the second last line imho';

'>>23357047
Eating at a food establishment is hundreds of years old, and isn't going anywhere. Just because it's a fast food place and not a traditional restaurant doesn't change much.';

'I prefer writing to reading. does that make me a hypocrite?';

'>>23357287
I hate reading. I hate books. I just want to tell this one story.';

'>>23351068
All right. So here goes. I don't exactly know the title or even author of such a story but I always wondered why places such as especially Japan with monarchy governmental systems are yet still doing so well. I remember sifting through some information and I figured a distant distant royal family of Nihonja had a princess and she fell in love with a commoner. Their king was so humbled warmed and affectionated by their genuine real and true relationship because it taught him what it's like to be every person in his kingdom. And it's like from then on Japan reigned with I'd say unspeakable ease yet generosity. Sometimes I wish our country was like that however yet again I did some research and Democracy is actually chosen to be the best form of governmental system throughout the entire globe. Personally I'd choose like the Green Party or Liberal you know like third party. But yeah that's my "Grandpa's Story Time" to share.

"Once you're done with the sports stadium of life—stay pure." - ???

I love this board btw. The Literature board. Great thread too!';

'>>23357051
Right...the point was that writers have to have a day job. And there are far better paying jobs than university professors, and they don't need PhDs. Frank Herbert worked full-time as an advertising writer for department stores, and Andy Weir slaved away in the salt mines of the software industry, to name two examples.
>hurr durr are you retarded or just illterate
Rude. Also, you can't spell "illiterate", so it seems you're projecting.';

'>>23357129
>>23357164
I'd say "pastoral" over "agricultural". It connotes more coziness.';

'>>23357528
>>23357528
>And there are far better paying jobs than university professors, and they don't need PhDs.
How does that invalidate the point numbskull? Virtually all writers today that aren't making a living from their books (and even many that are), are doing so from teaching.

>Andy Weir
>Frank Herbert
OK you're just a troll. Nevermind.';

'>>23357528
Yeah but other jobs don't let you bang a new crop of college sluts each year.';

'>>23357046
>"Probably around the same time you started getting your period."

nta, but I like that

>>23356863
well, the question you asked originally was is it melodramatic. and yes, obviously it's melodramatic but that in itself may not be deadly. there's plenty of melodrama in genre literature and movies and sometimes it's ok. melodrama does have the benefit of getting to the point quickly, so i suppose it depends on what else you have after this scene.';

'>>23357531
>It connotes more coziness.
In what world!? Pastoralists are the psycho nomads coming to ruin your comfy farming life!';

'>>23357129

"lie" should be "lay"

i would also replace "meadows" with meadowland or simply meadow

The two sentences do not combine well to create an image of where the protagonist is standing. We know behind him is the wall of junipers, but where is he (and all that) in relation to the house? It's almost as if the house is on a completely different property and has nothing to do with the first sentence.';

'>>23357575
nta, but he said "pastoral" not "pastoralist"

Are you a native English speaker? Pastoral has the meaning the anon suggested.';

'>>23357540
>virtually all writers
source: i pulled it out of my ass
>>23357552
>pedo rapist
>>23357575
Oh, nowhere, just the fucking Oxford English dictionary: "pastoral (noun): a work of literature portraying an idealized version of country life"';

'>>23357590
>>23357597
History is forgotten. I use pastoral as in pastoralists and so should you.';

'>>23357604
>hurr durr the whole world revolves around me and my limited experience
ngmi';

'>>23357597
>pedo rapist
>college
Spotted the hag enthusiast.';

'>>23357657
>my limited experience
Historical record is limited...?';

'I've been writing in a little notebook recently. Does anyone else do this? What do you write?';

'>>23357698
I've been meaning to do this. I'm currently reading my personal selection based off of Bloom's list of the Canon, and I want to have a notebook for every book on the list so I can ruminate while I read.';

'>>23357688
>Historical record
You keep using that phrase. I do not think it means what you think it means.';

'>>23357698
I once bought a notebook to make notes, but then realised I have nothing to make notes about.';

'I need to expand my cast somehow';

'>>23357767
based retard';

'>>23357726
>I do not think
Yeah you already showed that, not knowing the history of conflict between pastoralists and farmers.';

'I was writing some stories recently (including one that was based a dream) until I realized my stories worked a lot better as a short film rather than a short story. I feel like I am a visual person, and I get these really interesting ideas for scenes that just really can't be translated into the short stories that I write. I feel like I have more of a penchant for film, but it can't be helped that shooting films are so much more expensive.

Anyone else get ideas that you realize work better as movies than as writings?';

'>girl's beloved breaks up with her
>She feels horrible and her self esteem plummets
>She wants an easy ego boost, so she decides to ask out a loser who had a huge crush on her
>Loser used to worship the ground she walked on, but now is more mature, well groomed, better looking
What might be some self justifications for the girl? I wanted her to think of herself as a good person so she wants to tell herself she has a good reason to want to date the loser.

Also what could be some good reasons she tells herself she is attracted to the loser now that he's better looking? She doesn't like to think of herself as shallow but his improved appearance is obviously a factor she doesn't want to acknowledge.';

'>>23357778
How is that a problem?
I'm not saying this to be snarky by the way, I want to hear about your story and both why you feel your cast is too small along with why you seem troubled over the prospect of how to expand it.';

'I wonder how much Stephen King makes a year. I watched an interview with him from 1980 earlier and he said he started out writing short stories for porno mags.';

'>>23357824
I just wrote a horror short story that came from a nightmare and I think as an animated short film it would be better.
In my dream, I saw every detail of it, and I don't feel my writing captured the beauty and horror in all of it's glory.
I posted it up in the thread as a pastebin, shouldn't be hard to find.';

'>>23357164
I didn't know meadows had to be strictly wild. Good info.

>>23357179
>>23357181
I just wanted to set a lay of the land but you're right, adapting it to the MC's p.o.v. makes more sense. I'll rework it.

>>23357586
Thanks, good to know the house location wasn't clear. It's actually relatively important too so I'll change it to say it's next to the road. Didn't even think about that.

Thanks guys. Pastoral guy too, I like that word. Makes sense for my MC to use since he's a nature lover.';

'>>23357832
Beat it, chick. I don't want used goods, spare me the cuckshit.';

'THE SAFEST PLACE ON EARTH

"What in the world happened to your bodies, people?!"
"Ifs for saftee!"
"What do you mean...?"
"Allow me to explain, youngling..."
A man approached me, a normal old man, with all his limbs and many of his teeth intact.
"I'm of a family of foreigners from a faraway land, who have graciously been allowed to keep their customs without having to obey many of those herein, for generations.
"These are the people of Kawardis. A very nervous, yet aggressive race that has always sought safety at all cost, mainly in the form of prohibitions.
"First they banned spears, bows, maces, clubs, and swords as well as other weapons of war, because they were dangerous and harmful, causing many a wound and death...
"However, it didn't stop there. Once those were banned, knives started being used. So they banned them.
"The people starting punching each other, though, so now by law all citizens are to chop their arms off at 4 years old.
"Nevertheless, despite much effort put forth for the Safety and Prosperity of the People, they starting kicking one another.
"So they banned legs, to be chopped off 10 days after birth.
"Then people starting biting each other in rage, and they banned teeth.
"Sadly, though, sometimes people end up headbutting each other, so the government and the people are considering beheading infants while in the womb. All for the sake of safety, of course.
"Trust me, youngling, this is the safest place on earth."';

'>>23357848
>meadows had to be strictly wild

I would say agricultural meadow is equivalent to pasture for grazing animals. So I think it's fine.';

'>>23357859
The loser dude isn't interested in her. I just wanted a chapter where she tries to justify her choices to herself but it kind of falls apart when he picks at her explanation and points things out';

'>>23357863
I mean if you're going to make a political strawman, you probably could get it done with fewer words';

'>>23357870
Play up the regretkino. Make her fucking kill herself for not realizing how good she could've had it sooner.';

'>>23357874
>strawman
It's satire, from accurate observations. Also a parable.';

'>>23357869
I would just call that a pasture
t. meadow pedant';

'>>23357832
>She doesn't like to think of herself as shallow
but naturally she is. he does look better. he's got a good job and a nice car. maybe he plays guitar in band now. or she saw him shirtless in a bathing suit and she she saw the outline of his junk. the girl wouldn't think of herself as being shallow at all for those reasons - you might, but that's not what she would think of herself';

'>>23357891
That makes me think of something. The girl thinks the guy only liked her cause she was hot, but he liked her for another reason as well. She thinks it's okay to only want him cause he's good looking now as a result, without realizing her looks alone were never what made him desire her.';

'Which one is correct?

Lanterns illuminated the hallways revealing the prisoners’ faces.

Lanterns illuminated the hallways and revealed the prisoners’ faces.

The light from the lanterns revealed the prisoner's faces inside the hallways.';

'>reread my book 6 months later
Holy fuck this shit is fucking terrible. Why the fuck did I even publish it? It needs another round of drafts.';

'>>23358041
First two are, but the first one might be confusing due to 'hallways' seemingly being the subject of the 'revealing' phrase. Put a comma:
>Lanterns illuminated the hallways, revealing the prisoners' faces.';

'>>23358057
how long after you finished drafting did you do your edits?';

'>>23358057
I know exactly how you feel. I just went back last week to what I wrote in October after having not touched it since then and was embarrassed I ever saved it.';

'>>23358057
This but I never published it. Thank goodness. Now I'll give it the rewrite it deserves.';

'>reread a book I wrote three years ago
>it's still fucking great and better than anything I'm writing now
How do you cope with the realization that you've passed your peak?';

'>>23358041
>The hallways lanterns revealed the prisoners' faces.';

'>>23358118
>hallway
Phoneposting always fucks me over somehow';

'>>23357046
I see. I agree, your dialogue is a lot snappier and expressive while being less verbose. I'll try to write like that in the future. There actually is a stake to this introduced around the end of the second page (threatening a lawsuit for defamation of character), but you're right that I could bring it to the forefront sooner. Thank you very much for the honest feedback, and so detailed too.
>>23357062
It's a novel, yeah. I did feel like that opening line may have come across a bit too strong and bitter, good to know I haven't just imagined it. Starting off with the article itself is a solid idea and I'll consider it going forward. Thank you for your response.';

'>>23351068
Am I alone in struggling to write low-brow fun stories? I feel like I'm only truly writing when I write about pseud stuff with cool buzzwords like "the struggles of human intimacy" or "living as an alien trying to blend into society", and that when I'm writing simple short story stuff like Bradbury or Fujimoto, I kind of feel as if I'm wasting my time.
I fully understand that it's highly unlikely that I'll be one of the greats, much less published and lined up in bookstores. I just want to learn how to take writing less seriously and actually have fun like everyone else.

Any tips?';

'>>23358285
>There actually is a stake to this introduced around the end of the second page (threatening a lawsuit for defamation of character)
That sounds more like a climax or turning point than a stake. A stake is whatever the characters are unwilling to give up in exchange for what they want. They cake they want to also eat. The stake there might be that she doesn't want to resort to legal action since she still has feelings for the guy or because she doesn't want to spend the money and hassle or because she really hates lawyers etc. There is a stake for the guy--his article went viral--but it doesn't actually conflict with what he seems to want: apparently an admission of guilt from his ex, and it could be made much stronger. High stakes always means life or death, but not necessarily physical harm. The point is irreversibility. His article going viral should be life changing, something he's wanted for a long time. Taking it down should be the death of some version of himself that he's built up in his head. It could represent his big break. Maybe he's getting attention from magazines and newspapers he's always wanted to write for. Maybe there's even TV interest.

And on the other hand, you could make it so that the inventor offers to stop selling/working with Lorne Industries if he takes the article down. On her side, that should also be a kind of death. Lorne might be paying her the big bucks and working for them could be a big part of her ego. Of course, all of this has to fit with the greater arc of your novel and the plot you're trying to spin. But hopefully you can see how a bigger climax emerges when founded on high stakes and how the character's decision in the climax will reveal their character--far more than backstory or exposition--because it represents them dying in some way and coming to life in another.';

'>>23356721
Reads more like a 4chan argument than real life dialogue. There are no references to the world that houses your characters, just empty, edgy remarks back and forth.';

'>>23358115
By choosing a different mountain, climbing that, reaching another peak, doing it again until I've climbed all mountains. Then going deep, low, unto lowths, until I've been at the bottom of the Mariana depth and then resurface. Et cetera.';

'>>23357832
In the face of God there are no excuses nor self justifications. Have her self-destruct, have a near death experience, see God, resurface alive and with insight that she was, actually, from this small context, not a great actress, and instead of hopping boys, she should've stuck with the one.
Optionally and preferably make it so that the true pairs are repaired, and the 'loser' with someone who befits him, with everyone learning a valuable life lesson.';

'>>23357698
Finally, a fellow based notebook poster in this unbased not-notebooking scriptual thread.
I write notes and publish them. I practice languages, Dutch, English, my constructed language, in Latin, Greek scripts, as well as the l'école francais. I draw models for construction, diy-level, make drawings about what I do during the day during my small-time adventures and day tripping. What about you?';

'>>23357287
Based preferalist
Gmi';

'>>23356977
Nibbuh who says you weren't? In the face of the Big Bang, you were stardust. Even now you're flying around the sun, on this spaceship made of a rock with a hot core. Dang those aliens are shooting meteorites through our defense atmospheric shield, don't you see those sometimes? Think outside the NASA white-suited funny-helmeted Elon Musk rocket penile constraints. She did not destroy anything. If anything, she guided you.';

'>>23356935
>Trusting a 140 character text by April Henry on twitter instead of writing and proving her wrong
Not really making it at the moment';

'>>23356824
>Where has the poetey gone?
>>>/mu/';

'>>23356741
>Define 'rightly', or look it up in the dictionary
>Am I writing in the way that I defined?
>Y/N';

'>>23356550
Passive income? At one point your work will become outdated. For science: that's in 5 years. Money's an activum for a reason. There's no escaping poverty passively, at least, I don't believe that anymore.';

'>>23358608
This used to be me but then I learned how to relate my existential angst to direct personal (but still fictional) experiences with the absurd and started hiding my philosophy and history autism under lots of explosions and backflips
Now the serious writers instantly dismiss my work for being shallow and the casual readers have no fucking idea what they're in for';

'>>23356344
>You write in straight horizontal lines, +1
>The vertical line of the 'b's' need to touch the baseline of the ruling
>Some 'a's' look a bit like 'q's' and are sometimes a lot like 'o's'
>I read the introduction as: A man lays on bed. He thinks, but does little. We read his train of thought.m, and the setting.';

'>>23358608
Lean your notebook against a tree
Write about the ant walking on the branch
Eat a leaf';

'>>23359217
by all means you should write something to prove her wrong. but you shouldn't waste any time trying to get traditionally published, because unless you're already famous you won't get anywhere by going that route
>b-but then I'll have to market and do that other stuff I don't want to do
they'll make you do that anyway if you do get picked up, and the odds of you getting picked up are basically nil. unless you have a track record they won't even look at you';

'web serial posting is the real cheat code, no agents, no publishers, no marketing required, just hit the algorithm and start raking in patreon bux';

'>>23359280
>>>/biz/';

'>>23359345
I'd love to but I can't because I can't sell out hard enough.';

'>>23359361
skill issue';

'>>23359358
>>>/bant/';

'>>23359368
nobody wants to read what I write';

'>>23359381
sounds like writing will only be an outlet for you then. not sure what you're fishing for me to say';

'Is it okay to do a format change partway through a book. I have two POV characters are chapters alternated between them A-B-A-B style for the first 16 or so chapters. Since then my chapters have been getting long and needed to be split up (I try to limit chapters to 3,500 words or so). So now it’s a A-A-B-B. Would a normal reader be put off by this, or am I just being autistic?';

'>>23359436
There's nothing wrong with changing POV if there's a good reason for it and it makes the story better.';

'"I'm not a member of a dangerous cult." And after I said it I looked very hard at the ground, because it occurred to me I might be.

"It looks like a cult to me," she said, and handed me back my ID card. "And it's probably dangerous, because cult life would be terribly dull I they didn't keep you busy with some kind of violent adventures."

The face on the card did have a certain cultish vacancy to his eyes, like a stray animal. She stood up - we were sitting on wet timber - and scanned the horizon. I put the card away and watched a woodlouse clamber over plastic scraps.

"I can make it to the observatory by nightfall." I liked how she said it - with decision. By nightfall! What a phrase. "I'm inviting you to come with me, you understand."

Escaping is really very simple if you don't overthink it. She heaved her bag off the damp grass and we went down a slope and left through the same hole in the fence that she came through.

"What are these?" she said. Between the pine trees, statues stood on plinths, all white like dinosaur bones.

"I'm not sure, but I clean them on Tuesdays and Fridays. Let's go down here, they say there are cameras on those trees."

A piney smell, cobwebs, reddish needles on the ground. A blue cleaning bucket forgotten in a patch of nettles. Back at the compound they would be wondering where I was.

We jumped a stream and walked through a field that was jungly with high weeds. Big drooping ragged petals, yellowed and wrinkly, were covered in beads of water.

"Don't stop," she said. And we didn't until we reached a high ridge with a small bunker where we could eat.

A Radio Girl was there with a camping stove and a massive antenna. She wore a silver rubber bodysuit, just like I heard they did, and in red on her upper arm was printed 17172.

"Careful," she said, crouching with her finger on Transmit. "I could call in whole platoons just by saying the word."

But the Radio Girl cooled when she saw me. I must have still had that stray animal stare - it's the sort you pity.

When she realised we weren't a threat she offered us noodles and broth. Her equipment was crackling the whole time we ate, and sometimes a voice (giggling, solemn, full of ennui, it was never the same) would call out a code word over the speakers.

We had to leave. The sky was heavy with purple rainclouds and the air had that electric summer-storm feeling. I gulped down the rest of the broth and wiped my chin. "Watch out," said the Radio Girl as we were heading down the ridge. "I heard gunfire down there this morning."

We skirted a water treatment facility. "Algae smell," she noted.

On one of its walls someone had sprayed "17990 I Lov You." Beyond the wall, something metal and reverberant rolled across concrete and clanged into something else.

"We should get a gun," I said, very quietly.

"They have guns at the observatory. But what's important is to not think too often about death. Missing limbs and those sorts of things are okay."';

'>>23359460
>Let's go down here, they say there are cameras on those trees.
>t. splicer';

'>>23359381
nobody wants to read what I write, either.';

'>Finish the first major arc of my story
>It's good
>It's too good
>I put way too much work into this
>Now every other arc has to be this good too
I did not anticipate this issue when I started writing.';

'>>23357832
Seems like a revenge fantasy desu';

'>>23359553
you motherfucker, you oaf... it's a deliberate and justifiable splice... don't dare question my competency again';

'>>23359555
lmao, i have a similar first page that is too good, spent two months reading it daily and refining it to the point that i am afraid of writing anything else lest i fall into the same pattern of spending months editing one page. I am not so worried about not being able to write so much as the amount of time and effort it will take to do so.';

'>>23359578
You spent 2 months writing one page?';

'>>23359592
Suck my boner faggit';

'>>23359594
Ask your dad again';

'>>23351068
i dont really use lit all that much but i wrote this as part of a "story" that i am writng to house my self reflections

anyone who reads please tell me what you think so far

https://pastebin.com/J7RMMhq8';

'>>23359604
There are interesting descriptions and I can clearly follow what's happening but it needs to he toned back. This isn't dogshit, it can go somewhere, so I recommend reworking it to be a little less "purple".';

'>>23359592
i wrote it in one afternoon and spent the next two months editing it after i tried writing the consecutive pages and failed to recreate the magic, i am obsessed with the idea that the following pages need to flow perfectly from the first, its almost like a snapshot for all the themes, plot points, structures that will be present in the book';

'On my third rewrite of chapter 1
>First try was boring, essentially just the main character waking up on a mundane day and going through his routine.
>Second try was slightly better, ended up with the MC being picked up at an insane asylum, but it had two major problems : first, chapter 2 started with a short timeskip, which is the only time in the book this happens, and the whole thing just had a "prologue" vibe (I may keep it at that, but honestly I'd rather cut it)
>Third try might be the charm, I combine the character being already in the place he needs to be from the first try, while starting with a scene highlighting the reason he was in an insane asylum in the first place';

'>>23359642
thank you, but im not sure what you mean by purple';

'>>23357833
Need to make the world feel more lived-in';

'>>23359755
It's only really a criticism for final drafts, so take it with a grain of salt. I say it's better to have first drafts be a little too purple than too dry. Some of the wordplay I really enjoyed, like "puddles of moonlight".';

'>>23359847
ah yah that makes sense now. but i really like to write in an obscure way that makes it more like a puzzle, or trying to make things seem abstract but in a way where everything has a meaning and as soon as the reader understands the context the meaning becomes clear the reader then sees the final picture instead of the puzzle pieces.

does that make sense?

i do think that using too many mataphors might be a bad thing, but thats my reasoning';

'>It's a quiet evening in front of the computer and you finally find a plot development that you like

Fuck yeah lads, we've earned that fruit juice drink before bedtime.';

'I need a lot of help with exposition. As a concept. I just can't seem to incorporate it properly into my story.
I wrote the first draft for this scifi action story last year, it was the first time I was able to get to the end of a novel-length draft too, I struggle with writing long-form narratives. Basically it was about this mercenary woman who was abducted from her colony as a child by a mysterious alien race. She was subjected to horrific experiments that essentially made her superhuman before managing to escape with an alien exosuit bonded to her DNA. In attempting to track down the aliens that did this to her, she goes on to assist the human Galactic government over the years in various wars and conflicts before ultimately becoming disillusioned with the establishment and exiling herself from the territory.
This is all backstory, it's not the actual meat of the plot. And for the life of me I just don't know how to adequately convey enough of it so that it makes sense to the reader in a way that's interesting or entertaining. I tried only elaborating on her backstory as the plot demanded it, which resulted in a lot of nuggets planted throughout the first half of the story before the big reveal halfway through. I thought this worked. When I handed the draft over to a beta reader they essentially told me I didn't explain enough of who the protagonist was or where she came from, and that what I did explain came far too late. So for the past few months I've been stuck in this rut of trying to figure out how to fix this. I listened to some writing advice tutorials and tried implementing their advice in the second draft, which ballooned the first few chapters up another 15k words. I'm explaining more of the setting and elaborating on the protagonist's backstory much earlier, but now I can't help feeling the story's getting dragged down by it, that the exposition is clunky and sterile. It feels so alien to how I typically write, and I can't help but feel repulsed by it.
Now I'm at a point where I feel disillusioned with writing altogether. I fucking hate exposition. I'm not sure how I'm supposed to pull any of this off in a way that ties the whole story together.';

'>>23359758
Why?';

'>>23360041
you need to make it more clear from the getgo she hates xeno alien fucks. I already assume her essentially superstrong, superhuman nature is obvious, but maybe you should give her an obvious downside to having the exosuit bonded to her. something painful or embarrassing she has to endure every so often because it fucked with her system

>tried implementing their advice in the second draft, which ballooned the first few chapters up another 15k words. I'm explaining more of the setting and elaborating on the protagonist's backstory much earlier
you don't need to do this. all your reader needs to know is she hates them, and that whatever they did fucked with her. you don't need to get further in depth than that.';

'>>23360043
Because it's set in a very fantastical world?';

'>>23360254
Good talk. Thanks for sharing all the details of this world and your plot so that we can help you. Keep on keeping on.';

'>>23360258
Sorry';

'>>23360254
So? I’m trying to understand your logic here. It takes place in a fantastical world which means you need to make it feel more lived in and so you want to expand your cast of characters. Does any of this serve the story? Right now it just feels like you’re executing a program of “if A then B” with no real understanding of WHY.';

'Do you consider this good writing? It is not my work. It is copied from a novel from a very famous author.

To me it seems needlessly wordy and specific. It goes against most advice I hear today to keep things succinct. I don't need to know all the products on the shelves. It reads like a grocery list and has no bearing on the story, or even within the scene. But this was published and I'm not, so what do I know.';

'Are there any boards that have a fanfic general or is that basically this thread';

'>>23360371
It’s great. You should learn to write more like it.';

'>>23360371
Not really. But not all authors are famous for their prose. Or in the worst case scenario, every author has passages that won't inspire, especially with a large corpus.

I was pretty sure the former was the case (pop author, not literary author), so I wasn't surprised to google the passage and find it's Michael Crichton. You really don't think people are raving over books like Jurassic Park because the prose is beautiful? Like come on';

'>>23360371
I never understood why authors think describing things as "illumined by the moonlight" makes sense
Moonlight isn't that bright, definitely not bright enough to see through a storefronts window in full detail like that';

'>>23360371
Parts 1 and 3 are fine. It's paragraph 2 that's a mess. Just say "Other shelves held basic toiletries, clothing, and souvenirs." I'd also cut the Twinkies bit. What is this a paid ad? Get that outta here.';

'>>23360341
Serves the story because it gives characters a more tangible space to exist within.
Right now, I have roughly 6-ish major characters, but the cast feels far, far too empty for the world I've built
>A healer (The protagonist)
>A guard (Childhood friend/crush)
>Amnesiac mute
>On-and-off mentor figure
>A lady with weird-ass vampire-sickness
>Some weirdo alchemist
This is a very fantastical story, to the point that the cast isn't even human.
I need more small characters who can tell little stories of their own and make the world feel more alive as a result. I guess you could call it worldbuilding, but it's not exactly that. It's more that I need more characters to facilitate that stuff through';

'>>23360377
/trash/';

'>>23360482
>the cast feels far, far too empty for the world I've built
sounds more like you don't have enough plot threads moving and that's what feels missing. how many words in are you? introduce some chaos/minor villains/rivals into the mix.';

'>>23356824
a story, is a narrative. You are writing a story, not a poem. If I wanted to read a poem, I'd read a fucking poem.';

'>>23360514
Actually I do. There are antagonists and whatnot, I just think I need more side characters to help facilitate the world's existence as, well, a world';

'>>23360525
then make your antagonists cause more trouble for everybody, which allows your heroes to act more heroic by helping people in need
how many words in?';

'>>23360535
That's not the problem. I have antagonists, I know what they do, I know what the heroes do, blah blah blah.
I just need more characters to actually facilitate this story.
For example, there's a scene where our protagonist contacts a mysterious ferryman.
Or the scene where a bunch of village elders argue and cause children to cry.
I'm just having trouble with realizing those parts of the story. The small characters who nonetheless add a lot to our understanding of how this world works';

'>>23360561
I don't see what you're agonizing over. Disposable nameless, faceless characters come and go. Sometimes they get more details added the more you include them. What's the problem?
Because you refuse to answer the question I'm going to assume you're still outlining.';

'>>23360574
I’m not even sure if you understand what I’m talking about';

'>>23354493
>mods ban me if I just make my own thread for people to directly write-by-post in?
No.';

'>>23360576
You're concerned because when your protags enter the city you don't have a scene with Gilda the Breadseller, a mother of three and grandmother of four, who learned her secret breadmaking art from her grandmother and that's why her loaves of bread are delicious and renowned across the city. And the a guard, Bob, comes strolling by and says, "How ya doin' granny Gilda?" and they exchange soe banter and your reader meanwhile is wondering wtf you're even doing and could you please get on with the story please?
Please correct me if that's wrong.';

'>>23360585
Kind of?';

'>>23360516
You can have a bit of both. Narrative with no flair is like reading an instructional manual.';

'>>23360587
Don't worry about that shit. Focus on your plot and characters. If you want to highlight some basically npc character to give your world some spice, do so, but it's not worth losing sleep over.';

'>>23360592
That’s just it though. The side characters actively help to move the story along.
For example, there’s a scene where our protagonist is charged by councilmen with visiting a city to gather special herbs for medicine. The aforementioned city is a near-ghost town despite how pristine it is, and that’s because it’s constantly raining.
Now, how does he get to that city? He can’t just walk, it’s too far. So he must employ a ferryman, simple as.
That’s what I mean. Characters who actively help to establish parts of the world with their actions. Like
>Who grows the food?
>Who builds stuff?
>Who’s governing?
And so on';

'>>23360620
Goodness. You really haven't written word one, have you? If these are now the questions you're asking you've done enough outlining. Write a couple chapters. Hell, just write chapter one. You'll understand how pointless it is to try and plan that sort of window dressing beforehand.';

'>>23360620
I don't know what you're really imagining but what is so important about the ferryman? Does he even need a name? If he's just a one-off character that never appears again then why devote so much lore to him? He sounds like some random NPC you pay to get you over the river and forget him.

I'm writing a story about a road trip and I don't need to describe the gas station attendant. He's a part of the world but pretty inconsequential.';

'>>23357810
Pastoralist militancy might be a problem in your native Kazakhstan, but no one in the first world has to deal with that crap.';

'>>23360589
my dude. "prose" isnt the only thing that makes a story interesting. I know thats what /lit/ thinks but narrative is not "Character goes from A to B".
A story involves being invested in a character and the plot by means of characterisation, motivations, paying off things that were set up, and a conclusion to the plot and the character. All of these things are what readers care about ultimately, as they are the "story" behind "storytelling"';

'>>23360620
>Who grows the food?
>Who builds stuff?
>Who’s governing?
Vital questions Bethesda should have asked.';

'What is the word to describe a lot of guns shooting at once? Is it not repertoire? I could've sworn it was repertoire.';

'>>23360682
Volley
If that doesn't work, ask a thesaurus';

'>>23360682
if it was cannon fire or some larger caliber it would be a bombardment. maybe use onomatopoeia to convey the sensation of lots of smaller guns firing.';

'>>23360682
It's definitely not repertoire, but are you thinking of report? E.g.:
>By now the air was filled with the hoarse cries of fighting men and the report of rifles.';

'>>23360620
I just wrote a family that shows up in two chapters, and might show up again later. But I never referred to them as mother than mother, father, son, daughter.
The father was a soldier of the crumbling empire the main character made, the mother was a slave saved by the MC and worked as a maid under him.
They didn't need to need to be named or granted backstory beyond what I already gave them in relation to established things which need no further explainable.
How many chapters have you actually written? Or are you stuck in the planning phases?
Things are going to change as you start to actual write, that outline is going to shift and while your planning might be useful now, it might also end up as wasted effort for details that would've revealed themselves naturally as you wrote.';

'>>23360628
I dunno, I can't nail down what the issue is. I need to find a way to establish things without exposition';

'>>23360801
>exposition
now I'm completely at a loss. exposition would be you going off on a tangent explaining how he was a fisherman for years, but he had an accident and hurt his leg so he can't go out in rough waters anymore so now he's ferrying people across the river.
your ferryman, on the other hand, would be pure action. you'd give him his distinguishing feature, a limp, and he'd ferry them across the river. done and dusted. I have no idea why you think exposition is needed in the slightest.';

'>>23360837
Good lord you don't get it. I want to establish things about how this world works and the people in it by showing them just doing stuff in the background, slowly painting a picture of the way this society and world functions';

'>>23360842
Good luck. When chapter 1 is drafted post a copy, please.';

'God writing is hard. At least writing a LitRPG is (lol I know).
Still I have a respect for people who can pump out 3k chapters daily. Maybe I'll get there someday but man worlbuilding is a fuck sometimes.';

'>>23360086
So from the get go you would say the reader needs to know she was experimented on aliens as a youth and that now she's some jaded space mercenary. Right? Part of why exposition fucks me up is I can never determine what are the most pertinent details to know about a character or setting, or how to rank said details by level of importance. There are some things the reader needs to know as soon as possible, there are other things they can handle with being led on about for a while.
>you don't need to do this. all your reader needs to know is she hates them, and that whatever they did fucked with her. you don't need to get further in depth than that.
This is essentially what I've tried to do in the second draft, and I've attempted to make it interesting by interweaving it with memories the protagonist has of a past tryst with a former CO when she first began helping the Galactic military. Now the setup of the story is longer/more elaborate as a result and I don't know if I'm writing a genuinely intriguing narrative or if I'm just jerking the reader's chain. It feels like this more elaborate setup conflicts with the faster pace the rest of the narrative has, but now I like these narrative nuggets I've introduced and am unsure as to whether I should scrap them or not.
I just feel very lost, is all. I was very confident in that 1st draft and the beta seemed very nonplussed- I feel discouraged in a way I haven't been able to shake these past five months. It frustrates me since I know I won't get anywhere in this business by being sensitive';

'>>23357863
Have you ever read "Rash" by Pete Hautman? He had a fun take on The United Safe States Of America.';

'>>23360973
>So from the get go you would say the reader needs to know she was experimented on aliens as a youth
no. the reader just needs to know she hates xenos. and the reader needs to know the exosuit fucked with her system. these are two separate items, even if they are, in reality, directly connected. the straight line connection the reader does not need to know until later. I already figure you made it clear she's a jaded mercenary
>This is essentially what I've tried to do in the second draft, and I've attempted to make it interesting by interweaving it with memories the protagonist has of a past tryst with a former CO when she first began helping the Galactic military.
and I don't think you need to spell this out. all the reader has to know is she hates xenos, and her military background made her a super soldier, but it also fucked her up';

'>>23360964
>litRP
>wurldbuilding
>wordcount

/lit/ is a wash';

'>Ten days writing the first chapter of my first story ever
>Still nowhere near complete
>Feelings of futility set in as I wonder if anyone is even going to read through it once it's done
>Feels good to write, but I wish someone was reading it already
>It will probably take me the rest of the year to finish this
I keep telling myself I'm doing this for me, that it is an exercise in sublimation.
But fuck, I just want people to like my stuff.';

'>>23359261
Dang, that boring? How come? Has this idea of "expressing the two-mindedness that comes when you're trying to jack off to some random billboard or ad" been done before?';

'>>23361033
>Feelings of futility set in as I wonder if anyone is even going to read through it once it's done
Probably not, but don't write it for other people, write the story YOU want to read because it doesn't exist yet. As long as you're happy with it and enjoy re-reading it then that's all that matters. If other people enjoy it that's just a bonus. At the very least you can pass it to friends and family who, I would assume, would want to read it.';

'>>23361019
Word counts are important for making money via writing and bringing in views, only surpassed by content and characters. Think anon, think. No one's gonna read 1k word pages.';

'What's the actual word count minimum for getting something published these days? I hear anything from 40k to 100k.';

'Protip to beef up your word counts: do not use contractions.';

'>>23361058
maybe if you stopped writing for money, you'd become better authors then huh';

'>>23361084
I know most of /lit/ lives with their parents, but some of us gotta pay bills and rent.';

'>>23360853
How’s this for our first thingamaig?

It’s always been lonely around this place, and it never gets any less lonely whenever I come here to collect ingredients. Since I was a child, I never knew why nobody wants to live here, it seems spacious. As I hand the ferryman the toll, I wordlessly disembark from his boat, the rickety wood creaking beneath my footsteps all the while. The moment I set foot from out of the canopy of the aforementioned boat, the perpetual pattering background noise of rain goes from mere meters away to standing right on my shoulders. I can feel the hundreds of droplets bouncing off my surface like beads. It doesn’t really bother me though.
I survey my surroundings, squinting my pair of luminous orbs in an effort to locate any of the herbs, flowers, mushrooms, and roots I came here for. In rain it’s usually difficult to find any of those, but that’s when one doesn’t take into account how this specific area looks. The rest of the Abyss is structured like an enormous, endless fusion of cathedral, ecosystem, and cityscape, yet outside of the villages and occasional large town, it’s rather abandoned. Crumbled pillars of near-pitch-black stone, trees with vines and roots aplenty, and enormous structures the purpose of which we still have not figured out. Illuminated by unknown means, and usually murky like deep water, rain brings the already low visibility to nearly zero.
>Yet this place is different.
Blah blah blah';

'>>23361141
the more words you use to describe something the clumsier it gets. I mean you wrote like a hundred words and all I got was "I took a ferry. It rained. I looked at the ground." its so damn boring';

'>>23361140
You shouldnt degenerate the arts just cuz youre too lazy to get a real job';

'>>23361141
I'd cut quite a bit
>It’s always been lonely whenever I come here to collect ingredients. After handing the ferryman his toll I disembark, and the rickety wood creaks beneath my feet. Upon exiting the boat's canopy the rain's perpetual pattering of rain falls on my shoulders. It doesn’t really bother me though.
>I survey my surroundings in an effort to locate any herbs, flowers, mushrooms, or medicinal roots. It's difficult in the rain. The Abyss is structured like an enormous, endless fusion of cathedral, ecosystem, and cityscape, but outside the few villages, or occasional large town, it’s mostly abandoned. But this place is different.';

'>>23361211
oof, didn't delete two words, my b
>Upon exiting the boat's canopy the rain's perpetual pattering falls on my shoulders.';

'>>23359190
I just write down random thoughts, todos, draw my waifus and maybe vocabulary that I want to look up later. Using a little spiral notebook and almost filled that up in less than a week... I see people online takes two months to do that. So I bought a bundle of books from Amazon';

'>>23361141
>squinting my pair of luminous orbs
Did you just mean "eyes"? Or is this guy using some kind of crystal balls to locate the herbs? Maybe it's explained earlier.

I agree it could be trimmed. It's a big bulky, with terms like "all the while" not adding anything of substance. I usually try to adhere to "less is more".

It also sounds a bit casual. Maybe that's what you're going for. But stuff like "roots aplenty" and "we still have not figured out" makes it sound like your character is talking to a friend rather than narrating an epic(?) journey.';

'>>23361244
I guess I’ve always struggled with my vocabulary.
And like I said, nobody here is human.';

'>The bitter taste of adrenaline coated his tongue as the world around him fell silent.

Y/N? Trying to convey the feeling of when you're under super high stress your mouth dries and you get tunnel vision, but for hearing instead. I guess they call it "auditory exclusion", like everything just goes quieter.';

'>>23360371
I've come across the expression "light filtering through the windows" so many times I get an allergic reaction when it comes up yet again. I find being poetic only works when the paint is fresh, but after it has grown old, the artistry turns against itself. Being plain and succinct never ages.';

'>>23361141
Anon, I'm sorry, but... what's the story here? It's just a bunch of description with no conflict, I don't even know who our protagonist is yet. You even write 'Blah blah blah' like you're bored of your own writing; what am I supposed to think of it?

I'd recommend starting again, and starting later in the story. At a minimum, start with two characters, and start them in some conflict. And don't try so hard on the descriptions. 'Pair of luminous orbs' sounds so YA, I'm sorry to say.';

'>>23361262
Including taste is weird. Maybe:
"The acrid sensation of adrenaline flooded his veins, mouth drying and the world honing in on his target as all other sensations around him were drowned out in a muted dissonance."

I'm no novelist though.

>>23361141
Is there a magic system in this blurb? Try "I surveyed my surroundings with eyes imbued with mana, visible only to onlookers, as I attempted to scan the area for various magical flora. Given the current weather conditions, it would normally be difficult to find anything of note in the misty haze of rain, at least to the uninitiated. But for me, it was as easy as breathing. "';

'>>23361355
I haven't read the original, but I'd like to give a shot at the blurb you gave.
>In the mist one could hardly see anything more than a few feet ahead, other than my eyes glowing with mana. Those that saw my shine wondered when last they saw someone like me. But I paid them no mind, my eyes were for the magical flora, not the mundane people.
I think the blurb is just overly wordy, though it's only 8 words longer than mine.
The tone isn't something that I enjoy reading, it's rather dry to me. Mine does however come off as much colder, a man with a mission, pessimistic or above others.';

'>>23356977
How many Murder mystery writers have killed or solved a crime?
Has the author of Dune ever ridden a worm?
Has Orson Scott Card genocided a race with videogames?
Has Stephen King ever ran a train on a prepubescent girl with his friends?';

'>>23361428
>Has Stephen King ever ran a train on a prepubescent girl with his friends?
Probably.';

'>>23361428
>Has Stephen King ever ran a train on a prepubescent girl with his friends?
Well, now that you ask...';

'My fantasy story features an adventurer's guild...which is an exploitative, profit-seeking, hard-capitalist organization that pushes tons of menial labor on poor people with unreasonable terms, trash pay, and slim chances of progress. You either ruin your health trying to scrape together an honest living, or learn to game the system I feel I managed to accurately convey the stress and unfairness of irl working life. Tropes subverted haha!';

'>>23360371
narration represents the attention of the pov character. when you describe something in detail, that's the character showing interest in it. whether it makes sense for her to show that level interest in the contents of the store i don't know, because i don't know the context of the scene. writing teachers give people all these purely negative pieces of advice (don't describe things, don't use adverbs, don't try to stylize prose, don't don't don't) because they think you're an idiot that can't be trusted to exercise his own judgement. they are probably correct';

'>>23361428
you thought you were clever and mixed in the most likely with the most unlikely';

'>>23360371
fundamentals of writing, if there isnt a purpose to it, dont bother putting it in. if these things come up later, theres no problem. if not, its just a waste of time';

'>>23354720
Any more you can say about the story? Is it set in modern times, Egypt at the turn of the century, 1600s England?';

'>>23361492
i don't think "everything must be mentioned more than once" is actually a writing fundamental, i think it's just some retarded shit you made up';

'How many query letters should I send? 10? 15? Someone said they sent off about 70 before giving up, I think she was upset when I responded "70!?!!??!" but that seemed like loads at the time.';

'>>23361605
I think he's talking about conservation of detail. Most writing advice tells people to not spend five pages describing basic things. There's some quote by a famous writer which boils down to "People know what a road is, you don't need to waste words describing one". I want to say it's by Faulkner but I can't find it for the life of me.';

'>>23361290
it's obviously just an opening, not a complete story. don't be so harsh';

'>>23361726
Do in 60 in batches of 15-20 once a month. If you get decent feedback but no support, submit more than 60. If you get nothing for months, you need to improve the manuscript or your pitch. Write another book and query the first again later.';

'>>23361760
no, he's talking about some retarded misunderstanding of "chekov's gun" where he thinks he's not allowed to mention that a guy wears a hat unless he kills someone with that hat in the next chapter. writing is obviously meant to be purposeful but there are purposes that have nothing to do with whether something "comes up later."

your quote also doesn't apply to the excerpt we're discussing because abandoned structures on a dinosaur island are not mundane, and exploring them is very much part of the thrill of a book like lost world. the detail is appropriate and the book would be worse without it.';

'>>23361774
I know you're just starting, and the only way to improve the feel and flow of your writing is to write, but for later on down the road your story's intro needs to be well executed and gripping because that's where you're trying to hook the reader. Obviously when you're staring at a blank screen the best thing to do is simply vomit words onto the page - this pretty much is how drafting goes, in general - but after that, when you actually have some prose to work with, polishing your opening lines/paragraphs is probably the single most important thing to do. But keep at it. Writing is an iterative process.';

'>>23356580
I was living on my writing income long before I had anything finished to publish. Write genre fiction to Royal Road, offer advance chapters to your readers for a couple bucks on Patreon. I have my fictions signed with publishers now, but that's basically just icing on the cake at this point.';

'>>23362147
You on Netflix right now? There's this really gooey movie that supposedly came out in 1965 (it was made yesterday). You should watch it.';

'>>23362147
That's a lot of trash';

'>>23361906
Anon, you're not talking to the guy who wrote it. That's me.
I feel like my problem with writing is how I want to be descriptive in order to be more like an actual writer';

'>>23361355
>>23361364
I don't use the word "Mana."
Also, I drew a picture of him but it's got a bunch of text next to him. Makes him look like some crappy OC';

'>>23362313
>an actual writer
That's a problem. You have a lofty, distorted platonic ideal in your head, but the reality of "The Writer" is almost always much smaller, and meaner, and more crablike. Don't worship a false ideal. And, on the other side, give your ego a few well placed kicks every so often to keep it in line.';

'>>23362337
I just don't want to be bland. I want to create a vivid image of what's going on.
Problem is, how the fuck do you describe someone like picrel? Told you he wasn't human';

'>>23362344
I'm assuming he's a robot. Or a bug.

The creature stands just under five feet, almost man sized and almost man shaped, constructed with a sleek, dark grey (polymer/chitin). The head is blank and smooth, the only features of note are twin tumescent orbs for eyes and twin hornlike antenna that form an upward U.';

'>>23362344
Is he a robot? If it's a classic ancient magitech empire that collapsed, then mana in my rewrite could easily become ancient light.
Or, you can just be more direct, that he has sensors.
I think that sometimes the best answer is to use a more simple description to start, and then later, when the time is right, you can get more poetic when writing about your characters.';

'So long story short I still havent quit my job and none of my books are finished.';

'>>23362417
Yeah don't quit your job until you've already made it. Don't be a retard';

'>>23362385
>>23362380
Something like that. He's more like a golem. His whole species looks like him. Only variations are horn shape, light color, or any other defining traits like clothing or tattoos';

'>>23362313
Brilliant language is about doing most with the least, anon. Anyone can talk a lot. Not anyone can talk concisely. There's a reason why it's so much harder to tell a compelling story with a tighter word count. You need to make everything count, picking your story apart from the sentence level to the story level, with little room for rambling. This is talent.';

'>>23362498
I guess I just want to linger to paint a very vivid image of what's going on. Like, just describing "Glowing eyes" isn't enough to hammer home how they look';

'>>23362502
>receive 2 job rejections back-to-back
>one hour later, receive short story competition rejection
I fucking hate my life
2024 has been absolute ASS
Feel like I need a break from all this';

'The only things that keeps me from offing myself is the idea that one day I'll be published and then I'll be happier to live and write more. I've just finished revising a novel, what should I do now?';

'>>23362344
Talk about the light that shines through his joints, talk about his bright unblinking eyes and lack of mouth. Mention his horns, and his satchel slung around a waist that appears uncomfortably naked to the unaccustomed. Mention the two toes on his left foot. Describe in a short sentence what it's like to shake his hand.
Figure out how much of this to frontload, whether you need to dump this into a long block when you introduce him or spread it throughout the narration of the first scene. Experiment with this, shuffle phrases around until it seems to fit.
And remember that you don't need 1:1 full-fidelity transmission to create a vivid image.';

'>>23362606
Fair enough';

'Can a story have smut and gravitas? If there are chapters where the narration and dialogue get really horny, does that ruin the rest of the story?';

'>>23361811
>but there are purposes that have nothing to do with whether something "comes up later."

ok, but just so you know all that shit was boring. you arent letting the reader imagine this shit, its not engaging or interesting. The descriptions are bloated and go on too long, and by the 100th word all i can think of is "when is the story gunna happen?" and it never does.
The reader doesnt need to be reminded you cant see in rainfall, or deep water is deep, or that rain makes a distinct sound. thats obviously what i meant by shit that needs to have a reason';

'>>23362656
DH Lawrence and Henry Miller got away with it.';

'>>23362606
He's got nothing to hide though';

'>>23362606
Here's the thing though, there's no alien perspective within the story to make him come across as strange. This isn't a "Foreigner gets put in another world" story, although a character like that does exist within it.
His "Eyes" also do blink.';

'>>23353511
>you're absorbing the ChatGPT prose style
Fuck. How do I avoid sinking into slop?';

'>>23362723
That's good.
The luminous orbs line sounds like it could just be an author being purple, but unblinking orbs is more direct about him not being a normal person while still sounding a bit more poetic.';

'>>23362737
Don't talk about storms or dancing or light. ChatGPT repeatedly reaches for the most cliche comparisons, over and over.';

'>>23362748
Fuck, but I wanted to talk about how this girl had beautiful pale skin like the moonlight's gleam...';

'>>23362555
>I've just finished revising a novel, what should I do now?
Gee I'm sure we can answer that with literally no information. It's not like your book's publishing prospects vary enormously based on what the book is.
Here's the vague answer to your vague question: get it published somehow.';

'>>23362674
It makes complete sense that he doesn't wear clothes but if I met him IRL then part of my gut reactions would be "woah, naked". Unless I had previously become used to it by meeting lots of other guys who don't need clothes.
However now I'm reading back through the thread though and I see the narration is from the POV of the golem. That invalidates a lot of my advice because he won't be naturally thinking about his appearance. It's much easier to justify such a description when you're looking in from the outside.
You can invent a reason for him to pay close attention to his own appearance. Do these guys need to perform maintenance and repairs on themselves? Have a scene where he does that, mix all the description you need in there, then move on with the story.
Other options:
- You could introduce him from the POV of a character who has never met a golem before.
- You could mention details as they come up and leave the reader puzzling it all out. If you play your cards right you can get them invested in the issue and you'll add a subjective flavor, you get to point out that weird golem guys find it unremarkable to be a weird golem guy. I love playing those games but I don't know if you do and it means you'll constantly be messing with people's images.
- You can play this game for a little while and then finally narrate him from another point of view.
- You can try a third-person omniscient point of view. But that's a hefty change from first-person.

>>23362723
Do you ever narrate from the POV of that foreigner?';

'>>23362757
You can, just be sparing about it. Try other things.';

'>>23362759
I'm sorry for being vague. It's literary fiction, no fantasy or erotic stuff. A bunch of people find out reincarnation is real and form a cult searching for a way to escape the cycle. Around 70k words.';

'>>23362661
>ok, but just so you know all that shit was boring. you arent letting the reader imagine this shit, its not engaging or interesting. The descriptions are bloated and go on too long, and by the 100th word all i can think of is "when is the story gunna happen?" and it never does.
all what shit? what are you even going on about? we're talking about the crichton excerpt. the guy sold 200 million copies of thrillers but you think you know better how to entertain people? you think jurassic park doesn't have a story? what?';

'>>23362823
>the guy sold 200 million copies of thrillers but you think you know better how to entertain people?
Yes.';

'>>23362904
cool, post an excerpt so we can compare';

'I'm really not sure if I like this scene or not, what do you guys think?

Personally, I think I've made it a little hard to follow, and maybe lost the point. Might have fallen back onto big words as a defence mechanism ';

'>>23362768
The cast primarily consists of "Constructs."
The antagonists are a sentient plague and feral energy beasts, along with some manipulator fuckers';

'>>23362979
I think the paragraph starting with "memento mori" could use so spacing, maybe break it up in two when she switches from embarrasment to elation.

I am also not a fan of switching POV from one paragraph to the other without a clean break, maybe have her note his mistake on her own.

They gon fuk';

'>>23362979
It's incoherent and awkward.';

'>>23363125
That's a good point about the spacing, I'm so bad with the large-scale shape of the thing in general. I'll make those changes, it's by far the weakest paragraph in the book but it's a million times better than the first iteration. Thanks anon. They do fuk, but it's fade to black.

>>23363219
I thought so too.';

'Never add images to your books. I thought it'd be fun and enhance the world building and now I've got 200+ to finish in less than a year, not including the time needed to format them and place them into the manuscript.';

'>>23362768
Sort of. He's less unsettled by the culture and more how he's somehow in the body of one of them, which causes him to live as a hermit';

'>>23363420
Tell me about it. At first I thought I'd add some flair but now I got so frustrated with the inconsistency of AI I'm combining through my artist follows to find The One...';