'>>1123016
Yes. Problem is that there isn't any enjoyable modern MMORPGs currently available. So your only options are instance based games calling themselves MMORPGs, or old ass MMOs where everyone is at max level.';

'>>1123016
>>1123032
I'm looking forward to monsters and memories';

'>>1123016
Sure are. The problem is you have to find other adults with a similar schedule to you and mainly just play with them. Use all of the other players to chat with while waiting for your group to get home from work or something.';

'>>1123040
Looking forward to Ashes of Creation myself';

'>>1123016
Yes. Just don't grind. Don't chase for endgame.';

'>>1123016
MMOs were always for the outcast, slightly autistic, nerdy, lonely gamers who never leave their house or go outside, the genre wouldn't even exist without them
they played the shit out of early MUDs and went on to make the very same MMOs you get nostalgic for
normalfags need not apply';

'>>1123188
The problem is too many MMORPGs put way too much development time on endgame, leaving early to mid game completely barren outside of one mainline story quest and, if you're REALLY lucky, a few optional side quests, while endgame is bombarded with 20+ different raid bosses and endgame dungeons.
MMOs used to be about the journey, not the destination. Questing, hunting, and grinding towards an unattainable goal where you are one in a million on the same journey as everyone else, and, unironically, being about the friends you've made on the way. Partying up and socializing used to be encouraged and, in some cases, mandatory to get anywhere at a reasonable pace. Nowadays other players are treated more like a resource or commodity to be used for your own personal progression than anything else, which really hurts the "massive multiplayer" aspect.';

'>>1123188
>>1123322
Pretty much why modern WoW sucks so much.';

'>>1123016
Yes but its hard

Don't play an end game focused MMO, you'll burn yourself out playing what is effectively a second job

Find something that is solo friendly, but still has activities you can do with friends, for example my go-tos when I feel like grinding is EVE Online or OSRS, and if my friends are playing we can do roams or raids respectively.

If it has hard timegates such as daily/weekly throttling mechanics, avoid at all costs, that shit is cancer. And play on RP servers when possible, you don't have to engage in RP, but RP servers tend to have more community events than normalfag servers.';

'>>1123383
>And play on RP servers when possible, you don't have to engage in RP, but RP servers tend to have more community events than normalfag servers.
Love it when normals roll up on RP servers and turn them to shit trying to piggy back off a community they themselves give no fucks about. And then whine about being oppressed when RPers rightfully call them out for being shitters.';

'>>1123604
I didn't say be a shitlord on an RP server, just saying you're missing out if all you do is log in, grind, log out.';

'>>1123604
someone's projecting';

'>>1123016
no. dont listen to all the other coping retards and midwits';

'>>1123016
Nobody in their right mind is playing an mmo in this day and age for reasons other than sunk cost or muh nostalgia cope.';

'>>1123016
I often find that mmorpgs are most successful among populations who are looking for "more" from their lives that they can't (or don't care to) accomplish in real life. Sometimes that's just a feeling of importance (being a "top player" or having a significant impact on the world) or a social experience. I also think it appeals to those who don't have much control in their lives, which is why its popular among younger generations (usually under 18). For while they have less freedom IRL because of parents and things that come with being a child/teenager, they can have total control over a virtual character.

For me thats the way it is/was. I loved them when I was younger because of the freedom to make my own choices. As I grew older and got my own freedom, that aspect no longer appealed to it. Right now I "want" to play them for the social aspect. But modern mmorpgs and audiences have become so far removed from this concept (MMORPGs being treated as the main social platform, rather than something like a discord) that I can't get myself to stick with one.';

'>Is it possible to enjoy MMORPGs as a functional adult?
Not with every single MMO having more autistic ESLs and Americans than any other game genre. If I wanted to play with retarded faggots I would play games with 4channers, I won't pay a sub to do the same bullshit.';

'>>1123016
I have hated all MMOs since UO back in 2003 but have been enjoying the UO Outlands private server. Check it out.';

'>>1123032
Moba killed mmorpgs :( and then mobile gaming.';

'>>1127063
MOBA killed RTS
MMO just collapsed under their own weight';

'The only way to enjoy MMOs as a sane person these days is to play ones that are just good RPGs with a little bit of online tacked on. I resub to FF11 (or play during the free login periods) every now and then just to enjoy more of the game world and soak in the atmosphere. I've also been enjoying the DQ10 free trial lately, that game just feels like a DQ game (with a bit of FF11 DNA) that happens to be online. It's also a nice break from the insanity of the modern english MMO playerbase, which really started to grate on me when I was trying PSO2 and FF14 (which were both awful as RPGs and as MMOs, but I guess at least PSO2 was slightly enjoyable as an action game).

I used to play MMOs for the social aspect too but that's mostly gone these days. People who weren't there back then will protest "But I still socialize in MMOs all the time! You're just antisocial!" or some shit but they don't get how different it is. The quality of the average MMO player and their willingness to interact with strangers has dipped hard on both modern MMOs and old/private server MMOs for different reasons.

Modern MMOs are also extremely shallow from a character building/customization perspective and focused too much on endgame raiding and arbitrary grinds, neither of which were ever really much of a draw for a social player/exploration enjoyer like myself even in older MMOs.

>>1123188
>>1123322
>>1123383
These guys get it.';

'>>1128784
>I used to play MMOs for the social aspect too but that's mostly gone these days. People who weren't there back then will protest "But I still socialize in MMOs all the time! You're just antisocial!" or some shit but they don't get how different it is.

Yeah I sorta notice that too, but I wonder how much of it is down to my own behaviour ingame. It's so easy to get carried away with the gameplay loop until those dudes roleplaying seem like an unnecessary distraction, but after a while I remember 'why am I playing in the first place? It's certainly not to farm gold, exp or whatever'. It can be pretty good to drop profit making in favour of just hanging around some otherplayers, though a lot of the time for me that ends up being trolling or otherwise playing the antagonist.

Infact some of the best experiences I've had in online gaming are those dynamic social quests or whatever you wanna call them - the kind of activity that happens outside of the game mechanics. Seeking out a player, as a group, for revenge PK, or just sitting at a campfire chilling.

I've honestly considered joining Second Life just for the social interaction but it seems like the kind of comitment you don't come back from.';

'>>1123016
Unironically, it's an interesting question. What do MMORPGs pose that other genres do not?
The combat is worse, it's just watered-down action at best and cooldown rotation management at worst, the stories/writing are mediocre because they need to accommodate millions of "main characters", many of whom would find overbearing elements intrusive, which results in strung out patch-to-patch stories that put just as much emphasis on a revolving door cast as much as the player.
They literally excel at nothing beyond being a live service, so you either need to be non-functional or so functional you almost ALWAYS have friends on to play with,

>>1128784
>I used to play MMOs for the social aspect too but that's mostly gone these days. People who weren't there back then will protest "But I still socialize in MMOs all the time! You're just antisocial!" or some shit but they don't get how different it is.
This is very true. Maplestory prior to the BB Update, you could get lost in';

'>>1123016
Man, I miss 1.x. It was a fucking buggy mess but going to the WoW grindmill formula with 2.0 killed it for me.';

'>>1128837
nta but I keep looking for an MMORPG that has massive character and build customization. If someone could do something like PSO2's character customization options and the build customization of tabletop RPGs, I'd be so hooked. I'm just tired to death of the staple knight, mage, archer, and cleric archetypes that renaming them differently and giving them slightly different themes just don't do it for me anymore. Why an MMO? For the social aspect too but also feeling like I actually am playing a unique character next to other unique characters. An anti-example is FFXIV, even with the ability to change classes anytime, you have no real agency on how your character plays, everyone has the same skills and rotation and gears don't change anything about how you play.

as an aside I did dive into table top RPGs as I was moving away from MMORPGs and honestly just found it hard to get into or actively play plus I missed being in a virtual world.';

'>>1128852
I like the way DQX and FFXI do it, where each job has a certain amount of ability in different roles rather than being locked into one of the three of the trinity, ie. Ranger and Bard can both function as a healer as well as doing damage/buffing. You can fit together some rather nonconventional parties and do quite well.

Wanting PSO2 level character customization is unfortunately a big, hairy monkey's paw if you want the game to feel immersive in any way whatsoever, or I would agree with you. PSO2's playerbase is the degenerate mess it is largely because of it.';

'Yes, without us there wouldn't be a gold farmer market. Fuck grinding for in game currency thats for the no lifes just swipe the credit card and enjoy the content.';

'>>1123238
They were. Haven't been for at least ten years now. They already cornered the nerd market so MMOs have been pitching to normies for a long time. Only the hardest content done by <1% of the playerbase is unobtainable to normies now. MMOs are just SPRPGs with optional multiplayer. The only thing that penalizes you for not doing it fast are seasonal FOMO events which are not difficult.';

'>>1128876
It doesn't help that it's all largely egged on by sega themselves by doing collabs upon collabs and breaking immersion, plus sometimes their own stuff break immersion by being too out of place with the default sci fi setting. It's a hyper anime'd MMORPG as a result. I do still want somewhere near PSO2's character creation depth but dialed back a bit and keeping clothes in line with the setting so people can't really go too nuts. Degenerates are still a given though.

About build variety, part of that is the setting that supports it. I know it doesn't appeal to everyone but I really like settings that just allow a LOT to happen concurrently in terms of themes and cultures, especially when it leads to a fusion of several such as magitech. There's a lot of different cool character ideas that can be pulled off in such a setting without breaking immersion. Unfortunately that sort of thing you only get in tabletops and the really big ones like WoW, FFXIV, and GW2, but most new MMO's I've seen come out lately just go deep into high medieval fantasy, which, again just doesn't do it for me anymore.';

'>>1128907
>I know it doesn't appeal to everyone but I really like settings that just allow a LOT to happen concurrently in terms of themes and cultures, especially when it leads to a fusion of several such as magitech.
I can dig that, but it relies a lot on the execution. Maple Story was one I played back in the day that had an incredibly varied setting and it worked very well because of the visual style and the game not taking itself too seriously. Meanwhile stuff like FF14's Sage just feels weird and out of place to me. I think an MMO with a setting akin to the original Phantasy Star JRPGs, before the Online games, would work well for that, being like anime Star Wars/Star Trek.

Personally I look for variety in playable races and their cultures. I like it when games have a varied lot of races that all start in their own little fringes of the world and meet up in some of the larger cities/later areas. This is somewhere FF14 really tripped up compared to FF11, for me, since races in FF11 had clearly defined regions where they were the overwhelming majority and the other races were minorities. It adds flavor.

I love DQX's gigantic ogre ladies, fish bitches, and stocky goblin broads.';

'Just play city of heroes.';

'Pic related isn’t a mmo. Its a 300 hour singleplayer game with an optional endgame that just so happen to have other players that don’t interact they might as well just be npcs or like souls ghosts.
You can now even uses trusts to complete the mandatory “group” content, i give it a few more years before even ultimates and savage whoch are 1-2% of the game can be cleared using trusts';

'I play ff11 horizon which is about as hardcore as mmos can get, and it really isn’t that bad. I enjoy grouping which is the whole reason i play horizon over modern mmos/retail even if it means I can’t play on some days when I dont have 3 hours to burn to find a group, go to camp, and xp for an hour or two. Thats fine ill just play in a few days when i do have the time. I am now reaching level 75 with multiple level 30 jobs in a year of time of casually xping here and there. I wont ever achieve a relic but thats okay most of the game is within my grasp while i still manage to have time to do a dozen other things in a week. I think people just rush and log in 100 hours of playtime a week for multiple weeks to grind out leveling to reach some autistic endgame that was already solved 20 years ago so practically the only exciting part is the slot machine drop chance at this point and it murky the water for the rest of the experience leading up to that. Theres no need to rush bros, were all going to make it.
I also don’t see how dropping 400 hours into a mmo within a year is any different from normies dropping 400 hours in a few months on fornite or league of legends. Mmos get the most shit but video games as a while can be addicting to a lot of people.';

'Oh shit.. I'm getting real strong Ragnarok vibes from the ffXI Horizon launcher. I'm really not sure if I should install this game. It's almost a feeling of dread mixed with excitement. Like I'm about to dive into a fantasy world at the cost of reality. Do I want to be playing this game regularly for the next what .. year or more?
Please tell me I'm not the only one who feels shit like this when downloading games.';

'>>1130184
Idk about all that. theres still newbies everytime i start leveling a new job some guy has no idea how the game works in a low level party which is fine. its very time consuming. i still haven't hit max level after a year of playing with only a single decently long break but if your fine without reaching the endgame in 2 months it really doesn't matter. just playing some here and there is more than enough to make progress while having fun. sometimes i don't play for 5-8 days and its fine when i do decide to log back in. level 73 atm on my main job so about to experience the autism of the endgame just in time for toau';

'>>1129682
The people playing horizon are the same as ffxiv it just comes down to what MMOs captured you when you were younger. Where are all the camps in horizon? Colibri, worms, imps. If you tried to convince some people to go on a journey with you and try fighting a treant camp or w.e they'd tell you to go fuck yourself because it isn't the absolute best exp/hr.';

'>>1130906
The mmo that captured me when i was a kid was pirates of the Caribbean disney mmo. I never played 11 when i was a kid or knew it existed, i just like it even if your right people are set in there ways of what camps to do usually';

'>>1128784
based DQX player';

'>>1129682
Wasting time is okay if you have the time to waste to be honest, the biggest issue with the criticism is it usually comes from boomers that were essentially hand held their entire life and never really had to struggle to achieve the status they earned. There's plenty of good reasons to invest time in to other things even if it's just to put money in to the S&P 500 for 10 years so you can retire in your 30s. After you've settled though, even with a family, there's plenty of free time. It's just socially acceptable to watch TV for hours on end but it isn't to play vidya, or wasn't, these days it doesn't matter so much.';

'>>1132388
Comfy as fuck game. Having a lot of fun just running around filling out the bestiary and hunting mobs for gear upgrades since I can't use the player bazaar on the trial.';

'>>1130184
I was feeling like this until I saw the FFXI thread here with the usual private server drama that makes me concerned for it being around that year or more.';

'>>1132471
Is there some kind of translation patch, or do you read japanese? I had a guy years ago show this game to me and he was skipping past all the text and telling me the dialogue isn't important which isn't my idea of comfy.';

'>>1132583
I'm a huge JRPGfag who learned enough nip for vidya a few years ago. I heard there is also a real-time translation patch you can get to play in English but its machineslop and you need to give chatgpt your credit card number or something.

There's a new expac coming in March, maybe they'll finally bring the game over (I kinda doubt it, feels like they would have already and they'd probably be worried about it kneecapping FF14 or something), or at least the offline version.';

'>>1132583
>>1132592
there's a patch that has most of the story hand translated and MTL's the flavor text';

'>someone tells me that Final Fantasy XI has "lots of character customization"
>play the game, have fun despite the exceedingly slow pace, even come up with a job/subjob combo
>meet some guy, bring up my long term build plan with him
>tells me flat out that he's been playing since 2004 and that my character idea WILL get me ostracized by most groups, leveling or end-game otherwise
>immediately disincentivized from wanting to play the game ever again
I can appreciate the honesty but I don't understand why he expects me to share the same enthusiasm he has over being forced to slave myself to a meta that goes entirely against whatever class fantasy I had in mind to begin with. I'd accept this is the case for raids, but for leveling? Nah fuck this. This genre is for buck-broken faggots.';

'>>1133261
>I'd accept this is the case for raids
Or end-game rather, you get my point.';

'>>1133261
>>1133262
Sounds like you ran into the single worst part of FFXI - the community. If you can't find a linkshell that isn't a bunch of meta-obsessed risk-adverse 40yo socially maladjusted queens then you're better off just playing with Trusts. If you're playing on a "75 era" private server like Horizon then expect it to be even worse as they're primarily populated by those kinds of players.';

'>>1133263
I see. Decided to uninstall the game because someone's idea of a pep talk is telling me my RPG experience has to be curtailed for the sake of others says a lot about these sort of players.';

'>>1123016
I don't think so';

'>>1123016
All of these games are skinner boxes for fat women that need something as low stimulation as possible to kill time.';

'>>1126049
Fucking this, gachas spoiled me what MMOs could have tried to maintain their playerbase but alas. This is much more apparent when an MMO is grind-heavy and has means to buy your way to winning the game, which would absolutely get fucked by a gacha I am not sorry for Spiral Knights due to this.';

'No, simply because there are no good MMORPG.
Theme Park gets boring too fast and raiding is braindead.';

'>>1132471
i really, really enjoyed it but man i dunno if i can get back into it. the thought of having to do the story just doesn't jive. that, and the risk of a JP player calling me out. they did it before during the PVP event, spooked me a bit';

'>>1132583
it's machine translated with a few touch-ups from a small team. pretty nice people but it's your average discord group, so don't expect to make great friends. DQX can be very solo-oriented, so that helps.

>>1132592
if you like DQ and JRPGs i would 100% recommend DQX.
>There's a new expac coming in March, maybe they'll finally bring the game over
lmfao

>>1133396
yeah the whole raiding and parsing mentality is bonkers to me. if DQX ever came to NA, you just KNOW people will create parsing programs just for the hardcore stuff';

'anyone know any good wow vanilla tbc or wotlk servers? ones that arent laggy as shit and let you say nigger, preferably';

'>>1123016
no. MMORPG's require way too much timesink. co-op/multiplayer games are a much better fit for an adult gamer.';

'>>1133792
>the thought of having to do the story just doesn't jive
I personally don't really mind this since I can read nip and it's pretty well written. About on par with some of the later FF11 writing, which is to say miles above FF14's filler slop. On the other hand the sheer amount of quests to unlock things is burning me out so I might take a break for a bit.
>and the risk of a JP player calling me out. they did it before during the PVP event, spooked me a bit
What'd you do to get called out? Surely you can just pretend to be a keyboard-less Switch player or something?

>>1133794
I'm barely into DQ at all (only played 1 on SNES and 8) but this game has made me want to try a few more of them. 3, 4 and 5 in particular seem up my alley.
>yeah the whole raiding and parsing mentality is bonkers to me. if DQX ever came to NA, you just KNOW people will create parsing programs just for the hardcore stuff
Western MMO players from my experience just seem way more tryhard and no-chill with this shit for some reason. I'm nowhere near the endgame in DQX and I've never really been a raids guy but I imagine it must be pretty stressful having to menu through commands under pressure since this game doesn't seem to have FF11's macro system or anything. Finding the menu option to double the command menu horizontally and sort/hide spells and skills was a game changer.';

'>>1133836
>What'd you do to get called out?
didn't understand a mechanic and was tagged about a complaint';

'>>1133261
what character building? You mean merits and subjobs? Yeah dude if you plan to walk into endgame without a good subjob for your job people are going to start questioning wtf you are doing. In retail they actually balanced the game fairly decent and you can play 99% of it completely by yourself doing whatever you want like i usually play nin/blm for magic burst trait and almost every job has 3-7 subjobs that are viable but yes if you want to say do a level 65 birds party on horizon which would take a new confused player weeks to reach anyways and you dont /nin as a melee, your healer is not going to be happy you cant shadow to mitigate damage. Its like thet meme image spammed a few years back of some player saying he wants to go melee wizard and everyone goes “uh im not playing with someone whos gimping us and he spergs” its just how it is for everything.';

'>>1133910
Mucho texto just to write "illusion of choice".';

'>>1133911
You can still choose? Just dont be shocked when no one is ecstatic you chose to be a burden';

'>>1133912
>You can still choose?
You're just arguing in circles, idiot. How is it a choice if you'll get righteously shat on by the very community you're meant to interact with to allow for any sort of meaningful progression to begin with? Your leveling is predicated entirely upon people desiring your talents for so and so purpose. I'd (almost) be willing to accept this somewhat if your /nin subjob example didn't sound incredibly gay. This beefy warrior guy needs to be able to spawn shadow clone jutsus to be viable at holding the frontlines? God JRPGs are so fucking stupid, though I never played EQ so for all I know it could have been worse.';

'>>1123016
If you want the mmo itch but don't want to deal with modern mmo-troons I suggest neverwinter nights. All of the questing, none of the faggotry';

'>>1128876
I definitely like how DQX and FFXI play out on a controller. It's really comfy. Throne and Liberty seems to have a pretty decent controller support as well, so I can't wait for that coming to the west either. New World.

I'm also on the trying to find a MMO to fill my time with boat, with most modern MMORPGs requiring either quick reflexes, a lot of keybinds, or levels of dedication a full-time job can't support.

if any anon has any suggestion as to classic or somewhat old games that I can play that don't do click-to-move and overwhelm you with keybinds, that'd be appreciated. Otherwise I might just update DQX or keep playing Darktide.';

'>>1133915
>help i picked a shitty combo and people don’t want to play with me now, im being oppressed
Wtf do you mean you rather i have /sam /drg /blu / /nin or even /drk as a war, bro let me /blm so i can uhhh uhhhhhhh uhhhhhh uhhh warp myself????
Thats how fucking stupid you sound there’s plenty of choices but you decided to sperg because 20 days of play tome later people on endgame rather you have a sub that works than one that does nothing you fucking idiot';

'>>1133296
You should play with anons. Much better experience, but I can only speak for Horizon.';

'>>1134066
I don't respond to retarded straw mans because it tells me the other person has a womanly temperament. I'm literally just telling you that the game is not actually an RPG, so I don't care about it anymore.';

'>>1133948
guild wars 2 isnt old or classic but it's pretty relaxed and doesnt require you to do a lot of quick reflex stuff beyond the occasional dodging (which is very telegraphed. nobody fails it) nor does it have a million keybinds. it's kind of shit once you reach endgame but the process of getting there is pretty fun imo';

'all ur doing is updating meaningless database values the entire game can be completed by one dev with a 5 minute query. May as well buy a console and sit on the couch and play a story game like red dead etc. Much more immersive and instead of grinding a character grind yourself on hikes/at the gym etc. It's the path to adulthood';

'>>1134261
>it's kind of shit once you reach endgame
Is there even a current MMO that isn't like this? I never got the logic of people who can just keep playing an MMO's endgame in the modern age where they're not really the online chatrooms they used to be. When you take that out they become far less interesting since it's like playing a singleplayer game except you need hours of prep work and no interruption for muh raiding.';

'>>1134267
no i mean guild wars 2's endgame is REALLY shit. imagine the grind in wotlk for bis gear but you have to do that for anything you decide to do in endgame and it's 5 times as bad';

'Daoc Eden server is comfy.
>3 factions
>RvR (PvP with 3 realms at once)
>awesome character customization
>pretty fresh season';

'Started playing LotRO again the other day after about a year and a half. Since they'd added cardolan/swanfleet zones earlier in the year I decided to ride the full length of the old north-south road from Fornost to Minas Tirith. Took an hour and twenty minutes.

I still can't get over how big Minas Tirith actually is.';

'Only for nostalgia purposes. I like toontown corporate clash. It's a modernized toontown rehash.';

'>>1135811
Damn, son.
You sound experienced so you probably already know that they made quest content up to 95 free, or already have access to said zones. There's a code that was given out for some more stuff up to 120 but I believe it was earlier in the year for some reason.
Too bad the game sucks, both the netcode itself and the shit devs!';

'>>1123238
Bullshit.
There was an era where mmos like wow were the social media of the time.
Then we got myspace and later facebook and all the normies moved on.';

'>>1136613
That never happened, WoW never had Stacey rushing on after school to talk to Chad like MySpace, AOL, MSN.';

'>>1134201
>final fantasy
>rpg with numbers you press go up
you're the idiot for thinking otherwise';

'>>1134201
>screams about straw man arguments
>"Uh you're just a woman"
you sound like a faggot.';

'>>1123016
No. It is a bad genre. No matter how much effort the developers put in, the best outcome would be a very well polished turd, but a turd nonetheless.';

'>>1123016
>Is it possible to enjoy MMORPGs as a functional adult?

That's what the pay wall is for
Online interactions are not rated by the ERSB';

'>>1123322
>MMOs used to be about the journey, not the destination.

Not the ones I play, the journey is one more pvp item to give your character a 1% edge in a fight';

'>>1126049
>Nobody in their right mind is playing an mmo in this day and age

Even with mobile RTS on iPhone, nothing beats a PC MMORPG with PVP.';

'>>1126066
>Sometimes that's just a feeling of importance (being a "top player" or having a significant impact on the world)

True! Got a problem with that? If Hitler was born today he never would have invaded France, he'd be conquering a game world';

'>>1126066
>As I grew older and got my own freedom, that aspect no longer appealed to it.

How hard is girlfriend? How dangerous is fornicating (legally)? How much does she have to like you before "popping" a question?

You people need to start thinking with brain';

'>>1129485
>Just play city of heroes.
NCsofts worse title';

'>>1136021
Yeah. Last year when I last logged in was for the 15th anniversary event. Aside from the huge amount of stuff made free, people who logged in during it got everything but Fate of Gundabad and the 'further adventures of elrohir and elladan' mission pack. I've never personally gotten past Mirkwood until then so I got a huge amount of shit for free, as well as a bunch of collectors edition bonuses for shit like mordor, minas morgul, and war of the three peaks.

Like, I'm set until lvl 130.';

'>>1123016
Are there even any good MMOs out there?';

'>>1137021
there never were';

'>>1137028
There were... when I was a kid.
There are none now.';

'I like mabinogi but if you have adhd you will hate it despite the devs efforts to cater to people with no attention span.';

'>>1137021
No, not really.
-MOBAs capture the structured PvP aspect of MMOs better than most MMOs.
-Survival games capture the unstructured world PvP of MMOs better than most MMOs.
-Single player games or ARPG/ARPG-likes capture the raid and PvE elements of MMOs better than most MMOs.
-4chan and social media captures the social aspects of MMOs better than most MMOs.
MMOs require way too much commitment to do what other games let you get right into right out of the gate.';

'>>1137021
HorizonXI, retail FF11 if you're extra autistic.';

'>>1137029
i too was once a naive child
i know better now';

'>>1137049
guilds need a middle ground between lineage 2 (diff areas for farming materials to make weapons to capture castles to tax normies, etc) and league (leaderboards, resets, etc). maybe monthly server resets where winners progress into a slightly diff server or some tournament style shit
normies without friends would never play it so maybe that kills the idea, but as a daoc/l2 player id pay rent for the servers single handedly';

'>>1137021
Hordes.io';

'are there any mmorpgs where people actually party to do stuff together that isnt endgame/pvp? im tired of being alone until endgame only for everyone to be angry because no one reads the required guide to kill the dark souls boss.

the first mmos i played you usually immediately joined a party and started killing mobs together. these games still exist but no one plays them so you just slowly kill mobs alone until endgame which is worse than speedrunning through a story.';

'>>1140016
>people actually party to do stuff together that isnt endgame/pvp
I'm also looking for this
Horizon FFXI is the only place where i've experienced that but i stopped playing because the server owner and management is full of retards';

'>>1123103
that game is never coming out';

'>>1140016
guild wars 2
it's fucking awful once you reach endgame content but before that it's decent and the "quests" (events) are usually open to the entire world so people can just walk up and start doing them with you randomly. it happens pretty often';

'If you play gw2 for free you’ll want your money back. It was good at launch up through heart of thorns, then the trannies took over. It’s really tranny wars 2. Game also gets extremely boring when you hit max level. I have 18 level 80s, take it from me and just avoid that shit game. The only thing they care about is the cosmetic cash shop. They literally had the best PvP called WvW, which was made by old daoc devs, and they put that on the back burner to appease trannies.';

'>>1136970
cause ur too retarded to PvP people without massively out gearing them so they have zero chance of beating you. Play a real pvp game faggot';

'>>1140726
>Outgear
A problem exclusive to WOWclones.

Any PVP MMO worth a fuck has risk of losing your shit if you try to 'outgear' someone, just like committing to an all in on a RTS or buying an early round AWP in counterstrike or overextending in a MOBA.

MMOs have their own playing field that no other game can provide, WOWclones just happen to be shit at it because they instance the gameplay into 'balance' arenafag or battleground shit, and all loot is all soulbound dogshit';

'is base PSO2 just dead now? I've been thinking of hopping back in but I don't care for NGS';

'>>1140977
piece of shit online #2 (meaning poop) is not an mmorpg';

'>>1140710
My stupid ass bought all of the expansions and LWs up to end of dragons and only found out about that maybe halfway through the last expansion. It really does have an insufferable bizarre playerbase. If there was an mmo designed for reddit it would be gw2 and I wish I could get my money back.

Shame cause the game does a lot of things I like but the players are awful.';

'>>1144320
There’s an extra part in end of dragons where you’re in one of the lesbians apartments and find her vibrator. Literal tranny shit. The player base defends it “there’s other things going on besides the end of the world, people still have sex” biggest tranny cope I’ve ever seen. Even the living world got stale after 2. 3 was meh, could’ve been better. You’re not wrong about the player base. It’s the worst part of the game.';

'I was a wee bab when EverQuest came out, but I hop onto Project1999 sometimes if I want some comfy mob grinding. Problem is, my brain has been destroyed by years and years of WoW-abuse, so I keep getting bored and either making alts, which has lead me to barely get characters past the starting zones, or just burning out way too quickly for a while before returning and trying again with characters I forgot how to play. I REALLY need help sticking to one character for the long haul...';

'>>1144936
i understand and agree somewhat with the complaint but you shouldnt lead with something like that. it makes it sound like the vibrator is the only thing youre drawing the "tranny" stuff from';

'>>1123016
non-WoW MMOs i've enjoyed:
-The Elder Scrolls Online';

'>>1136613
>There was an era where mmos like wow were the social media of the time.
'sup retarded zoomer no.';

'>>1145059
It’s not. The peoples characters running around a medieval style world with flash wings and colors is where I take the tranny aspect from. The vibrator part plays in how the trannies ruined the game with their degenerate ideology.
>>1145309
That game is pretty comfy despite the hate it gets.';

'desu im just waiting for the throne and liberty release and blue protocol aswell, blue protocol its what SAO games shouldve been im dissapointed beyond limit';

'>>1145494
>The peoples characters running around a medieval style world with flash wings and colors is where I take the tranny aspect from
these two things sound completely disconnected. i mean this in the nicest way possible (i'm on your side): find another way to describe and discuss these things because you sound deranged when you string words together this way';

'>>1145494
>That game is pretty comfy despite the hate it gets.
The IP does a TON of work. It carries that game hard. That + all the "singleplayer RPG aspects" pretty much defined that games success. Trying to play any sort of "serious" endgame of that game just makes you sad at how much of a disaster it is.

>>1145369
He's not completely wrong.On one hand social media existed before WoW (like myspace opened in 2003, also had things like AoL messenger and shit). But they were niche just as much as WoW was in the grand scheme of things/general masses. That overall was very common among video games, but especially mmorpgs. People would just hop in game to hang out. Not really with any goals because that helped get their social fix. Their chosen mmorpg with the forums or some gaming community forums open in one tab. While also being in a vent channel or teamspeak channel. As time moved on and other social media came out, this became less common. Instead you hung out in social media areas. The real final nail in the coffin in my eyes came in 2015. With the release of discord, it blew up in gaming communities. I've joined quite a lot of gaming groups ranging from official discords to just "gaming communities". And people treat that as social media. It essentially snuck in as "facebook for gamers". People who do this wont admit it, but the way they post/behave is very much like people on twitter/fb/instagram. Discord took that behavior of vent/TS+community forums+mainstream social media and consolidated it into discord.';

'>>1132388
>Mereade
Jesus the further out I get from playing V4 the more I appreciate her. Your screenshot alone was enough to get me all misty eyed. It's crazy because I was such a big Mereade hater for a long time in V4 she just seemed so pointless then those later story patches happened it was a wild wide.';

'>>1145926
I’m sorry you feel that way. Trannies took over gw2 and ruined it. Simple as. I don’t really care what strangers on the internet think of me. Just spreading the word about the trash game that is gw2.';

'>>1146322
if you care enough to "spread the word" then you should care about how people interpret the words you're spreading.
>they added flashy cosmetic wings
>this is because of trannies
sounds utterly retarded. work on your rhetoric';

'>try gw2 because people keep saying it's great
>entire pve game is just 2012-era WoW combat-tier which means full homogenization + memorize rotation
>they completely dump the base game story after it ends and introduce new characters
>the characters are: some charr that nobody cares about, the mulatto with the absent black father(…heh), and lesbians whose entire shtick is THEY'RE LESBIANS AND THEY LOVE EACH OTHER
>DID I MENTION HOW THEY'RE SO CUTE AND CONSTANTLY CALLING EACH OTHER ADORABLE NAMES??? THEY'RE GAY AND IN LOOOOVE!

this game fucking sucks fuck everyone who recommended it';

'>>1146376
also
>>entire pve game is just 2012-era WoW combat-tier which means full homogenization + memorize rotation
we have to wait another 10 years for knockoff MMOs to catch up with WoW's realization that homogenization is fucking shit and defeats the entire point of having a class-based system';

'>>1123016
WoW private servers

best WPvP environment of any mmo';

'>>1127015
I second this, Outlands is the GOAT';

'>>1146376
forgot the worst character, the child genius who fixes everything
some of the worst writing in any video game';

'>>1146376
i dont think anyone who recommends it is recommending it for the story. we all know the writing is shit, it's mainly just the core gameplay loop outside of the story that people find fun';

'>>1146607
what private servers are there that are 4chan-friendly?';

'People who play an mmorpg are doing so to escape real life, it's a RL replacement.

So no, if you are happy with your rl you won't be playing an mmorpg (unless you're a streamer or something and it's part of your job.';

'>>1128845
However the upgrade to ARR allowed them to add a cash shop to a sub based game, and everyone accepted it because the first iteration was a failure.

That never would have happened if not for the first gaming being a flop.';

'>>1146362
sounds like youre one of the trannies.';

'>>1146607
which one though? never played wow beyond like a few days and there are too many pservers for someone unfamiliar with wow to choose. i don't have any real context on what wotlk or cata means for the gameplay itself tbdesu.';

'>>1147098
sounds like youre incapable of reading. you cant even tell when someone is attacking you versus when they're trying to help you';

'>>1147407
I can read fine, tranny. I just dont care what people on the internet think. GW2 is a tash game because it literally adheres to the trannies and does whatever they want them to do.';

'>>1147416
>i dont care what people on the internet think
>but im going to put effort into changing what they think about this game
>but i totally dont care
>also read my reply about how i totally dont care
brainrot setting in, i see. it's okay to care, man';

'>>1123238
STFU you fucking history rewriting retard everyone played MMORPG's back in the day and lonely outcast losers like you would have a thing called "RP server"
>>1136613
>social media of the time
no more like MOBA of the time everyone who played these games back in the day moved on to League of Legends or other 2010's competitive games.
>>1136623
This is true, only chicks IRL I ever knew who played MMO's where these 2 like weird 6/10's who hung out with a guy wearing an Atari t-shirt. These games were obviously not meant for nerdy outcasts they were waaay too popular for this. Literally EVERYONE played them except for uber normalfags and women.';

'>>1130184
I played 200 hours on the Horizon private server when it started up at the end of 2022. I found it very enjoyable, my most enjoyable MMO experience since the huge RP-PvP wars on Moon Guard in WoW in 2013, or since the huge weekend mothership wars in Air Rivals during the late 2000s. The mobs are too difficult to solo, so you are forced to join a party with other people in order to travel through dangerous territory or to farm mobs for exp or a quest drop. Farming takes hours, and the combat is low APM (your abilities come off cooldown once every 20-30 seconds) that you can type and chat with your party during combat. You can form friendships, and because there was no humongous megaserver with millions of players, but instead a few thousand players, there was a community. You got to recognize the same faces and build relationships with other people. The most fun part was doing the quests, like assembling an 18 man group to go into the mines and fighting those scary dangerous skeletons for the subjob unlock, or going into a beastman fortress to get a key item to progress the next part of the story, or travelling through dangerous caverns and across frozen wastes to fight a scary tiger for the level uncap quest. It was very addictive.

Unfortunately I began looking for a new job and couldn't continue no-lifing the game. Private servers are temporal and prone to collapsing very quickly, either due to the population evaporating or the management having to move on (finding a new job, going to college, getting married, losing interest, etc) or drama within the management. I would have to no-life the game for several months on end to see Promathia before the servers probably collapsed, so I decided to quit.


>>1133261
>>1133263
>>1133910

When I played Horizon last year, I was in a levelling party with someone in Rolanberry Fields, and he said he wanted to be a greatsword wielding paladin. Wonder if he achieved that.';

'>>1147531
>STFU you fucking history rewriting retard everyone played MMORPG's back in the day and lonely outcast losers like you would have a thing called "RP server"
Eh depends on when we're talking about. 90s? yeah definitely not. Early 2000s? Ok yeah it started gaining popularity, but wasn't quite there. Wasn't till the late 2000s that they went hardcore "mainstream" with WoW really leading the charge on that. People did play it. EQ, UO, etc. But I'd no way consider them mainstream among gamers. And they definitely weren't mainstream among "normies". Gaming itself didn't really start the trend of becoming the powerhouse we see today until the late 2000s.

There was this really interesting special time that I'd say falls between 2000-2006. It was this moment that gaming was this middle ground of being a niche hobby and mainstream. And you had a lot of really interesting interactions with people from the social bubble that formed during that time. You 100% do not have people who hopped into Dota 1/2, LoL, HoTs, etc; just to talk and hang out. They played a game and maybe partied up with friends. But not like "sitting in a major city chatting in guild/map chat". VRchat is more what MMORPG social scenes were like during the late 90s and early 2000s in terms of how people behaved.';

'>>1145926
"tranny" is literally just a meaningless buzzword these days to these people, like cuck or if you're a real oldfag 'fedora' used to be back in like 2010. you'll routinely have people calling everyone in the thread trannies, and probably missing the actual trannies that post';

'>>1147747
>oldfag
>2010
Fuck off tranny newfag';

'>>1147665
>There was this really interesting special time that I'd say falls between 2000-2006
I completely see what you're saying and agree with you if you're talking about online PC gaming. Everyone did play consoles though obviously. The way I recall it all my buddies where playing some kind of F2P Korean MMO and things like Lineage II and RO were somewhat popular. EQ and UO are a bit before my time and maybe more popular in America? or maybe I missed out on them because I couldn't get a monthly subscription.

When I referred to the people switching to MOBA's I suppose I mean people who really enjoyed the PVP aspect of these games but then couldn't find the time to level a character and deal with the timesink of MMO grinding to get to the good end game parts.';

'>>1123016
the glory days of MMO games are over. there will never be another UO or EQ or AO or SWG. I tried playing FFXIV and it was basically a single player game with raids. the story eas the same for every single player. that's super lame. there hasn't been a good MMO in decades.';

'>>1147828
>Flyff
Holy fucking nostalgia bomb. Is this the Saints Morning arena, if so I remembered it being much smaller.';

'any1 going to play Ravendawn?';

'>>1128784
>>1128802
>I used to play MMOs for the social aspect too but that's mostly gone these days. People who weren't there back then will protest "But I still socialize in MMOs all the time! You're just antisocial!" or some shit but they don't get how different it is.
Alot of it has to do with faggot trannies, beta men, and ugly women taking over gaming
It really depends on how lax the rules are in whatever MMO your playing, on most retail servers for western mmorpgs like WoW etc the rules are draconian tier where faggot GMs will ban you for the smallest amount of banter, so majority of the players are too afraid to speak their mind or even chat, while on WoW Pservers with more lax chat rules you see tons of people having a good time and chatting it up nonstop.';

'>>1149550
>on WoW Pservers with more lax chat rules
where? which servers?
every server ive found has had insane rules against insults and criticizing the gms';

'>>1147747
2010 is newfaggotry
fedora is newfaggotry that came over with the reddit immigration around the same time. autismposting is another lingering plague from the same origin point';

'>>1140118
Leveling in gw2 still feels kind of lonely though, in the same way that walking down a busy street can feel lonely.
The fact that you dont have to actually make a group means you dont feel attached, level scaling and the lack of quests encourages players to run off in different directions instead of sticking together, and the hearts are all easily solod.

>>1134261
The endgame is unrewarding by design, since gw2 wants to limit the power gap between mid-tier and high-equipment, and puts more emphasis on exploration and running whatever event is currently on.';

'>>1150377
>puts more emphasis on exploration and running whatever event is currently on.
This leads to dead maps as well. Everyone wants the fresh content so don’t expect too many people running old map metas.';

'>>1123016
It's possible but it depends how busy your work/personal life is. MMO's don't really respect your time.';

'>>1150377
>level scaling and the lack of quests encourages players to run off in different directions instead of sticking together
you only get scaled down though, so early game players are still very limited

>the hearts are all easily solod
not in HoT, which was probably my best experience in the game';

'>>1138079
>must sign in with google
dropped';

'>>1151878
poor anon cant handle the stress of spending 10 seconds to create a throwaway google account :'(';

'>>1151883
I just won't do it. Last time I did, google required a phone number after a week and I became locked out of my game (it was a different game).';

'>>1151884
thats not a thing that happens lol... pretty sure you just saw a 2FA prompt and didnt realize you could click past it';

'>>1151889
I think it was because I set the gmail to include both the words "jew" and "nigger". It must have been automated.';

'>>1151890
>I set the gmail to include both the words "jew" and "nigger"';

'>>1151893
To mitigate the stress of spending 10 seconds of creating a throwaway google account.';

'Nothing will come close to the archage alpha. fuck everything and fuck you';

'Are there any MMOs you can enjoy without having played an MMO before? Stuff without HP bars etc?';

'>>1151939
Ragnarok Online';

'>>1137021
Fuck it play ragnarok online.';

'>>1152182
>>1152252
Well that was amusing.';

'>>1151930
You could try a private server or a fresh start official one.';

'Is City of Heroes worth it? I guess there are 2 different servers, which one is the better one?';

'Is there any point in ever playing any MMOs at all?
It's like you're just intentionally giving yourself a sunk cost fallacy. You can perceive this even when you start up for the very first time.
You already know there's no gold at the end of the rainbow. Just an infinte grind that will make you feel worse and worse the longer you continue.
The only reason to play is if you're desperate to make online friends, but players these days don't even do that anymore, they just silently trudge from one task to the next like bots.';

'been playing Albion Online for the past few years because everything else sucks but i'm burnt out
I know Lost Ark is dead p2w koreaslop but is the leveling/story worth to try out?';

'>>1153816
Idk what is the appeal of going on an adventure in huge online fantasy world with thousands of players PVP, Guild warfare, sieging enemy castles etc... I played these type of games endlessly in their heyday and I have not made or kept one person as an "online friend" people "played" things like Second Life for this purpose. Also there are plenty of games where you really don't have to grind all that much to get to endgame. I wonder which ones you have played to make you think the essence of the MMO experience is "infinite grind and "making online friends"';

'>>1153816
Is there any point in life at all?
It's like you're just intentionally giving yourself a sunk cost fallacy. You can perceive this even when you start up for the very first time.
You already know there's no gold at the end of the rainbow. Just an infinte grind that will make you feel worse and worse the longer you continue.
The only reason to live is if you're desperate to make friends, but people these days don't even do that anymore, they just silently trudge from one task to the next like bots.';

'>>1123032
>Problem is that there isn't any enjoyable modern MMORPGs currently available.
There are if you aren't a pimply contrarian who never bathes.';

'>>1123032
Try ravendawn';

'>>1123103
>Ashes of Creation
Couldn't imagine a more generic game if I tried. It's like the shit they'd make up for a movie that some kid would be playing on a computer because they didn't want to get the rights to show a real game.';

'>>1128784
FF14 is great fuck off. The story makes up for the gameplay shortcomings.
Also hard to imagine someone saying FF11 is for "sane" people it's one of the biggest, most obtuse timesinks I've ever experienced in MMOs.';

'>>1157215
try
>Sword of Destiny
it makes sense in the witcher but it's actually the most generic fantasy title ever thought up';

'>>1157217
>The story makes up for the gameplay shortcomings
it really doesn't
Shadowbringers is just monster of the week shounen anime bullshit';

'>>1157217
I've been seriously considering starting FF14 recently and reading a lot of discussion about it, and everyone always says 1 thing - play for the story. The story is good. Best video game story of all time.
Is it really that bad of a game that you have to say shit like this?';

'>>1157752
Eh I played it and it feels like any other tab target MMORPG, just with a weeb flair to it. Like if you liked the endgame loop and combat of WoW, you'd probably like FF14. If you preferred say action combat akin to NW/Gw2, then you probably wont like it.';

'>>1157835
I've never played an MMO I just want some friends and preferably a gf.';

'>>1123016
I only play games that I can start playing from the desktop in 30 seconds or less. There are a number of MMOs that can hit this benchmark. Most recently, Ravendawn. It is a 2d-archage tibia clone. People talk about pay to win, but long load times literally just waste your time.';

'Love me PreTBC WoW
Love me multi class MMOs
simple as
I’m getting none these days';

'>>1123016
if the MMORPGs actually cared about the MMO part then yeah but devs have stopped caring about social aspects and created inferior versions of regular RPGs. it is sad because there is a market for people who want to find friends to game with';

'>>1157845
Yeah idk man. Making actual friends is tough now a days, especially on a MMORPG. With how much people switch around games. Its probably better you join something like a meetup. Most of the people I've met in my adult life are more "activity" friends. Not really the traditional friends. They're people htat I may meet up with or see at a specific activity. In the scope of a MMORPG, probably join a guild and be a regular on their discord and stuff. As far as GFs go, yeah good luck. You and 90% of the single guys on mmorpgs want to meet a GF. Which is why so many of them hate joining voice or letting anyone know they're a gal. They get hassled a ton. Same situation with meetups. Women started avoiding that app because every single guy at meetups would ask them out.

It sucks to hear, but if you're truly serious about finding a GF and meeting people. First, make sure your social skills don't suck ass. There's a lot of guides online on how to socialize properly. And I'm not talking about the andrew tate type stuff, that will not do you any good in the GF department. Second, lose weight and be in good shape. Three, live an interesting life. Have things to talk about. And finally, go onto online dating. Something like 70% of relationships in the US for people between 18-35 started via online dating. It is dominating the scene now despite how fucking much it sucks to use.';

'>>1158441
online dating sucks dude, if theres 4 guys hitting on 1 girl IRL its even worse online. but whats even more criminal is that all girls on every app look the same and have the same hobbies (getting wasted, going travelling, working out but nothing actually interesting). dating apps are for finding girls to hook up with not a serious relationship';

'maybe if you play the older relaunched ones and can enjoy the unique settings and stories, what mmos were trying to pull off to combat wow before everything became generic neon blue highlight armor korean shit. it's insane how those games actually had neat shit going for em and now the top 3 mmos we got now is a several month long point and click grind sim, an ugly catgirl erp game for pedophiles and trannies, and that dog shit wow. people dont even know theres an mmo out there that plays like deus ex 1';

'>>1158748
>online dating sucks dude
Oh I know. But that's just the world we live in if you're in the US. An overwhelming portion of relationships, even serious ones, have started out online. I'm sure its probably even higher if you account for people who are lying/embarrassed that their relationship started out on tinder. That's not to say don't try anywhere else. But trying to find one in a MMORPG is like online dating on hardmode. Keep trying to date elsewhere/IRL AND do online dating. At the end of the day, its really a numbers game. The more you put yourself out there, the higher chances you'll have. I mean shit before covid hit and shut everything down, I was a lot more social than I am now. I'd go to things like cooking classes/events, museums, dancing, bars/clubs, etc. Almost everywhere I went was male dominated. Post covid, that has only gotten worse. There's a reason why "single status" in the US started sky rocketing after online dating got popular.

Again I'm not saying don't try in a MMORPG, don't try IRL. But do them all. Live an interesting life with hobbies IRL, take good pictures, get in good shape, know how to do a profile/socialize. It will greatly improve your chances in online.';

'I'm really starting to realize how much I miss Classic WoW. I left when they announced the Store Mount and Level boost in TBC, which was my favorite expansion.
I've been playing Final Fantasy 14 for the past 2 years now, and it's great, but it just doesn't fill the niche it once did. It's hard to explain, but everything is just a bit too neat and clean.
You put on your designated gathering gear set to go out and grab things from a list in clearly laid out nodes that you can look up in the Gathering log.
Gearing is better from an objective standpoint, but just feels so soulless. Raid gear is it. No random 1% dungeon drop that turns out to have some special unique effect that synergizes with your build, or a quest reward that has better stats than anything else for no reason. Just roll need on raid gear you haven't gotten yet, and meld materia for your class's preferred stats.
I love Final Fantasy, I've sunk about 3700 hours into it. I'm not even getting bored of it, but it's not exactly filling the niche I was hoping for when I left World of Warcraft. the idea that I can randomly stumble across someone who's struggling on the same quest as me, group up, complete the quest, split the loot, and go our separate ways remembering the time fondly. Having your own identity based around your own limitations. Just being a Fire Mage with Tailoring and Enchanting instead of "That guy who plays Scholar, Black Mage, Red Mage, Gunbreaker, and Bard, and spent two months grinding all crafters to max"
Has anyone felt similar about FFXIV? I've been watching some old WoW Classic videos, and realized that Final Fantasy doesn't really lend itself to emergent player driven storytelling like WoW does. Maybe too much focus on the actual game story instead of what happens between players.';

'>>1159576
As an XIV convert, I've been feeling the itch to go back to WoW recently probably for the same thing you've mentioned. While I love being able to play every single job with one character and not miss out on any story, it doesn't feel nearly as Massive of an MMO. Yeah, there's a ton of people around, and instances always have sprouts, but the world is just kinda... sad. Hell, even when leveling, it was mostly a solo endeavor.

I'm thinking of leveling for Cata classic, since Cata+MoP is home for me, or just making a character on an Era server, just to get that ancient feeling of the struggle again. Even if I end up leveling alone, may be it'll feel fun?

I know that, since going to XIV just before the WoW exodus, I care a whole lot more about the journey than the destination. The stories, the casual moments between leveling, those are all fun. I don't care for hardcore endgame stuff, which is probably why I haven't done much of anything in Dragonflight. XIV has inspired me to try and play old patch campaigns before moving on to newer patch campaigns, but WoW just isn't that kind of game, and it kinda sucks...';

'>>1123016
yes but only sandbox games, like OSRS, EVE and Albion. because you're too old to play themepark mmos, and what would keep you engaged is player actions which is most prominent in sandbox games';

'Is there no fucking mmo other than evercuck and FFXI that requires coordination and interaction?

Every fucking MMO is a singleplayer game with MMO paint.

Jesus christ im going nuts, do i really have to play a FFXI classic server just to get this experience?

Dont @ me with warcuck shit.';

'>>1123016
Play the story only in Secret World Legends.
You will have fun and a blast. As soon as you finish it just quit and only come back for holidays/season quests.';

'>>1162553
Why not just tell him to play a single player game if you're gonna suggest a dead mmo where he won't see anyone while doing solo content';

'>>1123016
i like turtle wow';

'I ruined FFXIV for myself when I was sitting down thinking what feels off about the game. The fact that playing with randoms in FFXIV feels like a chore and is not fun. Therefore the only true way to play the game is to have a party of people readily available, but that is hard thing to accomplish. As the homogenization of jobs has only made players worse not better.
A lot of scenes in this game are so heavily influenced by outside powers it is annoying - like PvP for example is mainly controlled by people who took a liking to the mode and fuck you over if you get on their bad side. DoH/DoL is heavily botted.
Rarely do I get people to interact with me in the overworld. FFXIV is one big fake nice community that will take you in if you accept their correct think about the game. But destroy you if you disagree with the "approved right think."
Also the game's netcode eventually got to me, I'm tired the game's tick where the skills don't translate to other games, mixing shit netcode with newer mechanics don't work either and you eventually end up having a bad system. Not to mention you stand and let things resolve generally in FFXIV for raid mechs and hope the netcode doesn't fuck over you or your static member. Also everything being on a 2minute cycle sucks there is no more flavor. Criterion needs a lot of work, I don't see the point in getting shit-tier rewards for something you need raid level gear with. Not mention majority of the players rather sit inside a player's house open up a twitch stream and listen to club music. A lot of newer players don't really like Eureka/Bozja. Island Sanctuary was a mess, felt like a chore I needed to do rather than something I ran around to relax and have fun
I really miss Wildstar actually, surprised there hasn't been an MMO that gives us our own housing instance to do what we want.';

'>>1162323
None of the mmorpgs require "coordination" and "interaction" at the end of the day. Including WoW. FF11 for sure, but not sure how active that game is these days. Can't really blame the developers. Players don't like to put in that kind of effort. Just the way shit flows these days. Majority of players these games, when met with difficulty that requires coordination...they quit or complain. WoW really only requires this coordination at what, high level mythics and mythic raids? Beyond that, its fairly easy that you can do all the content without ever saying a word to one another. Most other mmorpgs are in the same boat. ESO is all easy mode until you get the hardest pve (Vet traisl). New world, really the war pvp and raiding pve requires coordination. Gw2 only their version of hardmode raids and a couple of world bosses.

You can maybe try something janky as fuck like embers adrift or fractured online. Most of these "indie" mmorpgs are going this route you want. And they struggle financially as a result. anytime a big name mmorpg dips their toes into the "coordination" part of the genre, the playerbases throw a fit and quit. So they never do. Most mmorpgs these days, including the big name ones slated for release in the next 5 years, will design it like the following. Most of the game will be "easy". Leveling will be solo friendly. Endgame low to mid tier grind (dungeon finder or low level mythics in WoW terms) will require a group, but not coordination. Its not till you get to the very last kind of content. Something only 1% will see that you will see coordination required.';

'>>1123016
It is, but there's very few I really enjoy playing these days.

I'm old school, but I've never been meta obsessed. The sorts of MMOs I enjoy tend to be old or very niche, like FFXI or Uncharted Waters Online. It's hard for me to get a group of people together to play games like this because the main people who still play these games are absolute autists who can't just relax and have fun with it.

I paradoxically like games that appeal to hard core folks, but want friends who aren't afraid to occasionally pull a Leroy for the hell of it.';

'I've stopped and started FFXI retail dozens of times since launch. Never very seriously, especially before the game became solo friendly. I finally decided about a month ago to sit down and just fucking play the game from scratch with a fresh character. I always used to follow guides that were developed to propel you to endgame as quickly as possible, but this time I've just been playing through the story content in release order and have been ignoring everything else besides LB quests and necessary RoV quests that facilitate solo progression. I've been playing a few hours every night and I've been enjoying it. Finished up the original Nation line and am working through Zilart questline now. I guess that what I'm trying to say is fuck the guides and wikis, just do your own shit and have fun.

I guess if endgame happens it happens. I spent about an hour reading over guides and it all went over my head. Some of it seems solo friendly, but I just know it's going to eventually be that catch-22 of needing a group to progress but being unable to find one because everyone in endgame has abandoned that content years ago. You always get told that people in these old games are willing to help new players, but I've never found those people. Last night when I was playing there was a 2 hour autistic slap fight in /yell about someone entering an instance without the "proper" gear. I know enough about XI to know that's one of the game's biggest flaws. Don't have this exact earring that takes hundreds of hours of grinding to get? Welp, sorry, no invite for you. When everything has been "optimized" and min/maxed to the last minute detail in these 20 year old games, you just lose any motivation to keep going. That's not even counting having to know the correct mechanics for boss fights, how to macro, etc. I know a lot of that is XI-specific, but there's some of that too in all of these older games.';

'>>1169115
Speaking of Horizon, I played it pretty hardcore for a while (~12 hours a day) when it launched and it has a lot of the same problems that retail has as far as the player base and optimization goes. "No, we have to camp here, the other spot gives us 3% less XP per hour." "There's no reason to do that quest or go exploring in that zone." "Why are you wearing that piece of armor, you should be wearing [X]." 95% of the people on these classic and private servers are grizzled vets, and in that case you lose a lot of the "journey not the destination" ethos that made these games so special.

There were some fleeting moments of that old school magic, mostly on the rare occasions I found myself in a random party. I finally just said fuck it and quit after I took like a week off from the game and by the time I made it back, the LS I was in had progressed past all of the story content we were working on and trying to find a full group to "go back" and play through all the stuff I had "missed" was like pulling teeth.

I know that none of that had anything to do with the OP or any of the previous posts, just felt like getting my thoughts out. Great thread btw, was really fun to read through.';

'>>1162323
Dofus requires coordination and interaction.';

'>>1123188
If only people got this
MMOs are a great platform for making long-term friendships, just don't burn yourself out or the others around you with an autistic grind';

'I came to the sad conclusion that you can't. Gone are the days of grinding Lineage 2, Ragnarok Online, RF Online, Perfect World, for days on end. No sleep for 50 hours? Not a problem. Nowadays no sleep for 2 extra hours than usual would ruin your entire week. Can no longer dedicate all of your free time to it, because you only get 2-4 hours of free time a day, and there's now so many things to do than investing into "half assing" an MMO (compared to the kids who consider 10h/day their regular playtime). You can actually master some hobbies with this little free time, so investing into an MMO turns out to be more and more futile.
I wish I could go back and relive my MMO experience as a kid and teenager, but it's not possible anymore';

'>>1169115
The problem with FFXI is just that it's a product of it's time, you can't really experience the game as it was meant to be played unless you can literally travel back in time. The old community definitely helped newer players and I've had countless experiences with people that were willing to sacrifice many hours of their own personal time, multiple times a week, year on end to help newbies. The NuInternet and NuMMORPG scene is filled with jaded people that have zero values, culture and wouldn't know what a community or self sacrifice is if it raped them. Most of them have grown up in different variations of mouse utopia, people often blame the industry, consumers, the general state of the west, politics etc but it's a combination of everything that has led to this this singular outcome. The friendly people we used to know online are far and few between these days. Even XIV is completely unrecognisable compared to what it used to be, it's awful. The only alternative I can think of is joining some niche fandom not yet infiltrated so you can recreate those moments.';

'>>1123016
no not really';

'>>1123016
There's a reason why I really like mmorpgs, it's the feeling of the world around you. Not a map that you know by heart and that will be with you for 40 minutes, but a world where you go for a couple hours away from reality and you can come back. Alas, it's all slipping down to sessions, cyber sports, metas, progression and rmt. There is no that sense of adventure and interest when you go to your first raids wagon because you don't really know how to play. Everyone is interested in your rio, whether your speck is meta, whether you have the "right" stats, gear and talents and how many bosses you closed. Even before I remember going to a raid, and there throughout the raid someone communicates, now people just keep quiet and at best rl something says.

Well and the age of top nerds who met personally the dawn of the gaming industry in the region of 30 and older, such people are already moving away from gaming maximum in sessions play in the evenings, character development for years is not interesting. and the new generation pokes his finger at the phone and think that the motherboard is lunch money at school.

Personally, I can't immerse myself in anything anymore, I only go to LOTRO sometimes out of nostalgia.';

'>>1174466
Yeah that's a similar situation to what I'm in. Everyone always scoffs at me when I talk about how it feels like the importance of immersion and "enjoying the journey" has been lost. Yeah there was meta gaming and "gotta go fast" players back in EQ and shit. But its no where as bad as it is now. Most mmorpg players look at mmorpgs like a competitive game, which it really wasn't meant to be. Having some hyper balanced and competitive pvp scene where people push rank. People trying to get through a dungeon/raid as fast as possible. A near religious zealotry adherence to metas.';

'Anybody here played DQX up to lategame and can tell me what it's like? Is it typical raidshit or is there other stuff to do? I was playing it but kind of fell off while doing story quests I was overleveled for. It and FF11 are the only MMOs that still slightly interest me and FF11 is an utterly abysmal state so I don't feel like fucking with it.

Part of me is waiting for some good small scale indie mmos (like 2d sprite stuff) to come along but another part of me knows they'd probably be rife with drama and hacking.';

'>>1175846
HorizonXI';

'>>1175961
I don't want to play on any server run by the emotionally unstable. Sounds like a very poor use of my time.';

'>lots of gear to play dressup with
>big world to go around in instead of "spam instance from town 24/7"
>actually people around you and things to do with said people, even if you never see them again the second you're done
Is that really so much to ask for. It's always 2/3 or something, I hate it.';

'>>1123016
I think everyday of going back to every title I've ever tried out and had fun, or trying out any new title that catches my attention and seems fun.
Then I realize all my friends that I played with are either offline or I've cut contact with them and I don't really have time to play those games and I don't really think I could enjoy the mmo gameplay anymore.
I also feel like I could never meet any new friends in those games like I did before because MMO communities seem more uptight and full of weird people nowadays.
I miss the times where I would just join teamspeak and have fun talking and grinding games everyday.
I hate this nostalgia loop that I'm stuck in.';

'>>1123016
Charr sex!
Human on charr sex !';

'>>1123016
>Is it possible to enjoy MMORPGs as a functional adult?
The only way I've found to do this is to be fully work from home and play while you're on the clock. I do this and it STILL feels like a waste of time somehow. I can't even imagine having a normal in-person job as an adult and still trying to play.';

'>>1160537
How is OSRS a "sandbox"
You can't alter the world in any way.';

'>>1176808
Or just don't be poor lmfao?';

'>>1176720
guild wars 2';

'>>1169116
That server has what, 2~3k peak population? So to be clear, either you're saying
>the only person on the server with that slower/journey playstyle is you
OR
>You quit before finding the 400 other players that enjoying playing exactly like you.
If the group you're in isn't a good match then just cut your losses and find another ls, those guys that rushed without you were probably having an incredible time because they were all on the same page.';

'>>1123016
I'm a 41 yo boy Jack. Come argue w me over how good I am at classic WoW on


that way better site reddit. I'm
the33rdparallel. And your trash. I win
every argument and I DO argue w everyone Aaaaaand win.

Later losers

Slava Ukraine

Blm

Tlm

#realmengetpegged';

'>>1123238
No it's not. Reddit is where I'd do my real

Arguing.

the33rdparallel, losers';

'>>1123016
EVE online. Thats the adult MMORPG';

'>>1148048
I did until 40. Great systems, interesting concepts and alot of theory stuff you can do. But the engine and gameplay itself is absolute dog shit. Worst combat you can have in an mmo by far.';

'>>1123032
scandinavians are making some new high quality one
>>1123238
no.
extrovert, no shame about anything, avoid talking to npc types - was always like that.
mmos were the best up to 2007 when you imbeciles came in hordes and destroyed them.
mmos were filled with cool people from all over the world who enjoyed games before the internet and found great enjoyment in mmos when they started coming out.
and then you, 2007 > wave came....
and there is not many mmos left where you will not come and bitch about how hard they are, how easier it has to be and much much more';

'>>1128837
BB isn't the update that ruined maple and it wasn't even a bad patch to begin with, it gets way too much hatred when the only bad thing it did was consolidate the map. Maple started going to shit when they began adding classes that ignored platforming and allowed them to kill entire maps like mechanic, mercedes, demon slayer etc. When LHC was around it wasn't uncommon to see funded demon slayers using demon cry and sitting on the middle platform in which they couldn't get knocked off of due to their free 100% stance.

Then the game started shifting towards solo grinding, instead of forcing players to rely on other people in the map to keep the spawn rate up as they kept buffing the capabilities of classes. It's not a coincidence that the game became more antisocial the less you needed other players in your map.';

'>>1140062
It's not exactly taking any longer than any other MMO to develop.';

'https://www.lineage2.com/en-us
https://www.bladeandsoul.com/en-us
https://www.aiononline.com/en-us/classic
https://www.aiononline.com/en-us
Are any of these worth playing?';

'>>1184137
Depends. I enjoy playing both blade and soul and aion from time to time even if they are mostly shadows of their former selves. Both are pretty comfy as far as korean mmos goes. You do need to know what you want from them, it is obviously full on p2w whale milking at endgame, but getting to it is a nice experience even if mostly a solo one. Then again i played both extensively around their release, so i am somewhat biased and might just enjoy nostalgia.';

'Big time happening.';

'>>1137021
Dofus';

'>>1187418
based and twelvepilled';

'>>1184137
They're doing a classic BnS server pretty soon I think. Never got to play the game back when it first launched so I might check it out.';

'>>1123016
>as a functional adult?
what a depressing word, imagine being a functional adult actively taking part in society';

'>>1184137
Seconding this. I remember enjoying BnS at launch and the PvP was surprisingly enjoyable.';

'Be real with me bros, honest chances of Throne and Liberty being a solid 7 and not DOA';

'>>1194626
apparently it's good but ruined by bots';

'>>1187418
Based, and I wish they weren't the only name in the turn-based strategy MMO scene. Dofus was max comfy.';

'>>1196380
Many such cases.';

'I wish Rift took off back in the day..';

'>>1196659
It did take off. It was popular but it was ruined by Trion's godawful management skills.';

'>>1196679
you know what I meant
either way, rip. it was fun and now it's bought by a company that skins mmos alive and leaves the carcass to bleed out';

'>>1162913
Embers and Fractured struggle because they're literally fucking SHIT they didn't even fucking attempt to make good games
Embers
>uses stock animations thats in shit loads of dead indie 3D games you can find on the net
>Not a single vendor had unique loot - this sounds goofy but in old mmorpgs it was WORTH checking merchants and vendors, EQ vendors would literally resell all manner of items players sold the vendor, sometimes you could find magical items a high lvl dumped for space and get a ok deal + upgrade
every single vendor in embers sold the same 4 stock boring items it was so fucking disappointing, not even a proper "grey" armor or weapon vendor was found so I could at least see cool armor, game is literal fucking trash with zero effort

This is why Monsters and Memories is the only REAL mmorpg currently being developed and thank god it's real, it's already been playable and they show all of their progress in real time via streaming

Been waiting for this for a long time, all devs had to do was make EQ but with modern tech that's it and M&M is doing just that.';

'>>1123040
spbp';

'>>1128784
I played mmorpgs since UO in 99 and a lot of it has to do with people literally being antisocial weirdos

If you attempt to socialize even a tiny bit people flock to you, I start random zone wide convos all the time, I run my own groups for content which makes people flock to me and want to stick around.
For some reason players are afraid to speak at all, they don't want to attempt to create groups, they don't want to chat in group unless someone else talks first and people are too fucking afraid to ask for directions or a strat during a monster encounter because they're so antisocial.

But if your a player who isn't afraid of any of that people flock to you like moths to a flame, some days it feels like it did back in the early 2000's, other days you're just stuck with antisocial edgelords same thing happened in 2001 nothing has changed except how shit modern dev design is today and invisible rules for the mentally ill which happen to be a lot of the antisocial fags (trans etc).';

'>>1196659
Yeah like >>1196679 said it was absurdly popular to the point it siphoned just about every WoW player for the first month, the queues were insane, I had to wait 9 hours to log in on day 1 on the most popular pvp server.

Game was managed badly and like most mmo's that attempted to compete with WoW they had terrible optimization.';

'i fucking hate raidniggers';

'not even fucking classic EQ is free of raidfaggotry meta obsessed apes
roleplay autists are superior in every way and they're all gone';

'>>1197287
Based, me too.';

'>>1130184
I feel this feel. That whole looking back on wasted time feel at the end of every isolating, time eating game. Socializing is expensive and I'm such a hobbyless wierdo. I'm not even into games or anime anymore- I just work, sleep, and take care of my mindbroken schizo room mate who got his mental shit pushed in by the lockdowns and is just now showing signs of coming back to reality somewhat.';

'>>1123016
The community of this game is way more toxic than most games it's just hidden behind a veil of politeness';

'>>1123103
The mechanics seem interesting but it desperately needs a visual overhaul, everything is way too generic and bland it has zero identity. Assuming it ever releases I think it will be popular for a week and then abandoned entirely';

'>>1123016
No.
Impossible.
Can't express yourself unless you're an 80IQ retard screeching about muh capitalism muh 1% and crying about how your made up gender is oppressed
People do not act human anymore';

'I want to play BnS with people.. I'll literally do anything.';

'>>1130184
I never get this feeling because it's really rare that a game can suck me in like that. I actually get excited when I find something that I know will occupy my life for a while. Probably because I'm a NEET that doesn't have much going on though.';

'>>1197279
Everybody wants to socialize but we’ve empowered the monsters in society to such a degree that everyone is completely afraid to take responsibility. They flock to you immediately when you show any initiative because it’s basically you saying “I am ready to be the fire shield for the mental fatigue that comes from the inevitable tard rage people doing things in a group in 2024 will bring.” And Godspeed you anon. If you can take the tard flames keep going. The world needs a solid set of people like you to heal.';

'Somebody should release EVE 2 already instead of wow clones / softcore anime porn';

'>>1179155
*retiree MMO';

'undefined';

'>no pay to win / progress faster
>active playerbase
>mostly english speaking
>no monthly sub
does this exist? If not, what would be the closest thing?';

'>>1200834
*crickets*
well i guess im gonna be waiting for Albion eu then';

'>>1201636
>no pay to win / progress faster
>mostly english speaking
Lol.';

'>>1201647
yeah no shit hahahah...... there's nothing to play, why don't you suggest another game then? oh right, because it all shit more or less';

'it's*';

'>>1200834
I don't think GW2 or ESO have any P2W mechanics from what I have played';

'>>1153816
This is the only good post in this thread.
The problem is that people are already living with either Stockholm syndrome or the progression mindworm from the golden age. Everybody is chasing the high from when they were younger, accepting dogshit games that will barely give them the fix while robbing them of their time.
MMOs are basically cigarettes for losers.
A game should be replayable due to skill progression or artistic expression, not because of arbitrary grinds like >>1134265';

'>>1153816
>>1134265
>>1203298
As sad as this sounds, playing MMOs is what gives my shitty life purpose. I don't have the motivation to play a single player game but I'm willing to put hours in an MMO just to get a sense of accomplishment.';

'>>1203657
MMOs are a blackpilled genre imo. This is why them becoming popular with normies perplexes me. It's the typical experience of being a loser in real life where you fail a lot until you do enough to just get by.';

'>>1204423
a decent MMO appeals to a variety of people otherwise they wouldn't be financially sustainable. so it follows that not everybody who plays them is the same.
normalfags that play MMOs enjoy them for casual/social shit like light roleplay or dressing up. they're the type of people that enjoy second life or final fantasy 14 dance clubs.
they are (usually) not the same ones raidlogging. but MMOs need them too because otherwise you end up with a wildstar situation.';

'Which currently available MMO is the most quintessentially MMO? Suppose I wanted to put MMO Gaming Experience on my resume, which MMO(s) could I list to definitively display that I know things about MMOs?';

'>>1213212
GW2 or WoW I guess.';

'>>1213212
EQ1 progress server';

'>>1213212
there's too much variety in MMOs for any one game to give you credibility when speaking about the genre in general. like, being a hardcore raider in WoW isn't going to give you much insight about EVE's economy, social dynamics, or PvP. and if you want to understand even a single MMO you'll have to invest a ton of time into it so you can experience what the long-term endgame cycle is like.

I would pick any currently active MMO that appeals to (You) and play it to death. then branch out into other games with a different focus.';

'>>1213212
Runescape';

'>>1203294
gw2 has elite specs, which you can only get by buying the expansions. without them you cannot compete in pvp, wvw and in pve stuff like fractals people will not accept you in groups if you do not play the latest meta, which requires elite specs.';

'>>1197287
Get good casualfag';

'>>1213212
wow or ffxiv for endgame pve
runescape or bdo for sandbox
eso or gw2 for open world and realm v realm
wow or gw2 for pvp
then you'll be missing a korean grinder, a full loot autismgame like albion and an oldfag clunk like EQ1 for bragging rights';

'>>1215202
i mean i guess you're technically right but that doesn't feel p2w to me for some reason';

'No. Play UO Odyssey with anons instead >>1215003';

'This game is gud and you should play it.';

'>>1213212
Most quintessentially MMO game possible on the market right now is EVE Online, despite the DEI new hires they got trying to make instanced dogshit and minigames like Abyss and Faction Warfare';

'>>1213212
mabinogi
>>1217934
>bdo
isn't player interaction required for something to be considered a sandbox game?';

'>>1215202
oh wait then you also have to buy the copper fed salvage o matic, material storage expanders, bank storage expansions, shared inventory slots, infinite salvage tools, unbreakable gathering tools, sanctuary pass, living world seasons and probably some other shit too. god damn that game is just as expensive as black desert regarding pay for convenience shit, at least that game only demands you buy a tent and maybe some maids on sale while you can get the other shit for in-game silver, but gw2 players will show you an entire list of shit you need to play comfortably.';

'>>1218461
>Fallout 2 but 3d multiplayer';

'When's Vanguard coming back?';

'>>1223989
>multiplayer

There's like seven people online during peak hours.';

'>>1176720
City of Heroes.';

'>>1213212
Definitely Dofus';

'>>1213212
Horizon XI';

'>>1123016
Problem with MMO's as a genre is that it was conceived as an experience where you get to make new friends from all over the world and it was the social interaction that made it great, but then moralfags complained that their kids were being exposed to adult themes and language and so companies gutted all the social elements in order to "protect the children" so now you don't even get to chat with anyone unless it's spamming "WTS" in a trade channel, other players are all mutes doing the same grindy thing as you in the background rather than people you can interact with. The only way an MMO will be good is if they force people to actually talk to each other using a proximity based chat and have content that requires you to team up with a player based economy. That won't happen though since now all items are binded to your account on pickup or on being equipped and trading often isn't even a thing that's allowed.';

'>>1233497
>then moralfags complained that their kids were being exposed to adult themes and language
You faggots have turned every single chat function in every game into a gay child grooming cesspit, kill yourself post haste';

'maybe. once you have everything theres not much to grind for that isnt gated behind weekly resets';

'Try wurm if u like runescape and Minecraft. I cant believe i never heard of this game til now';

'>>1218461
I remember being excited for this and then it was truly rancid';

'What's it like having enough free time to play MMOs? I take on as little responsibility in my life as I can possibly get away with, but I still have no idea what changes I could make to my lifestyle that would allow me enough free time to play this excessively time-consuming videogame genre. I genuinely don't understand how people have lives while playing these kinds of games. I played some Phantasy Star Online as a kid, but never enough to max out a character or get the truly good gear or anything. Then I tried WoW when it was new, and was absolutely shocked at how the game went out of it's way to waste your time. How do people spend literally hours of their time right-clicking on rocks to collect ore, or other similar chores, and think to themselves, "Yep, this is quality gameplay right here. This is a good use of my time". I swear MMO players are bigger NPCs than the in-game characters that assign you your quests. You'd have to be an NPC to just be okay with a game blatantly disrespecting you and your time like that. When I play vidya, it tends to be more arcadey actiony stuff, 'cuz it's alot easier to fit a few rounds of Outrun in my day than some grindey-farmey RPG bullshit.';

'>>1239390
>"Yep, this is quality gameplay right here. This is a good use of my time"
No one thinks that, same goes for tycoonfags. At best they think "Yep, the numbers are going up, I'm getting richer/stronger" or are having a socio/political/psychological discussion with the voices in their head or don't think at all.';

'I liked how GW1 funneled players together via mission outposts, as the only way to physically progress was through them and people only had one reason to be in a mission outpost. I don't know why other MMO's never adopted them. GW1 was probably the best MMO to get anxious pubbies to get used to grouping.';

'>>1239402
> don't think at all
So, an NPC then.';

'Recently I've started playing Lineage 2 BGM in Youtube, and now I'm feeling the urge to level a warlord and a dark elf support

Wtf is happening to me?';

'>>1128837
>This is very true. Maplestory prior to the BB Update, you could get lost in
seconding >>1181481
I genuinely despite nostalgic henehoes who constantly bitch about BB being what killed maplestory when the game was alive for several patches after that, especially because you faggots always shill FoTM servers to play on but then leave after a few weeks when you remember that the game sucked during those versions. BB revitalized the game by adding more party content and fixing the dogshit balance (only to release mechanic which was OP, but even they got hit with the nerf hammer fairly quickly) and several questionable systems/game design decisions. The game was incredibly active when LHC heavily incentivized party grinding.
The only part of the world that even changed much with BB was Victoria Island, and most people left that area anywhere between levels 30-40 depending on if they cared about the mushroom kingdom. Victoria was only revisited on occasion for if you had quests or wanted to say hi to a henehoe friend.

Maplestory didn't go to shit until Unleashed, which was so fucking reviled that it nearly killed KMS and GMS ended up getting a modified version of it.';

'I have never met an MMO player who lived in a clean house.';

'>>1239390
i have a full time job and still have the time to play multiple MMOs (one "main" MMO and a couple on the side). do you have a really long commute or something? every day i have at least a couple hours to kill. now that i think about it i could probably get away with gaming at work if i wanted to....';

'>>1242338
Yes, I commute. We can't all do comfy work-from-home busywork jobs, some of us have to do real work. I have 3 hours between when I get home from work and when I should be in bed if I want a full night's sleep, which I do. And I have things I need to do and things I want to do aside from play videogames with that time. I suppose if I really went out of my way to play an MMO in that time, I could, but I'd have to go pretty damned far out of my way to do so. How much time do you have after work?';

'>>1239390
why do you sound so whiny? maybe just neck and get it over with';

'>>1242530
>8 hours a day at my job
>1 hour spent driving to and from work (no, I don't work from home)
>8 hours asleep
>1 hour preparing to leave in the morning
On work days I still have 6 hours left to do what I want. Of course there's cooking and cleaning but they don't really take much if you prep your meals for the week ahead of time and dedicate a couple hours a week to cleaning/laundry.';

'Does anyone here play on TERA private servers?';

'>>1242063
You've probably never met a person who played a real MMORPG either. The people you're referring to are subhumans that fell for skinnerbox game mechanics. Those aren't real MMORPGs because there's no actual roleplaying in them taking place.

Yeah people can /me *nuzzles into your chest* gay bullshit but it's not the same as playing something like EVE or UO where they're manipulating the economy and altering the world state as a sci-fi/fantasy life simulator.';

'>>1123016
MMORPGs have morphed from a roleplaying experience in an open and interactive world into a skinnerbox addiction hampster wheel.
I genuinely believe MMORPGs should be regulated to be adult only like gambling, alcohol or nicotine.
And like nicotine, alcohol or gambling, any adult who overindulges in MMORPGs is an absolute waste of life.';

'>>1242931
you're not me >>1242930 but I like you';

'>>1242930
The survival genre is more like what you're describing.
Conan, Ark, etc are all more like UO and EVE with substantial economics/crafting.';

'>>1242934
Ark more so than Conan since you can transfer characters so you have maps acting as zones but yeah that type of game really did transition into survival shit, which is a shame because I don't like full loot/hunger/thirst mechanics that feel like they're nagging you all the time.
So pretty much there was UO, Asheron's Call, EVE, Galaxies, Face of Mankind and fucking nothing after that. What a rotten way to die.';

'>>1242922
I'm about to try one. Haven't played the game since it went F2P pretty much.';

'undefined';

'>>1242922
I downloaded menma to try it out and I have no idea what I'm doing.
though it doesn't help that I partially downloaded it for elin erp';

'The problem with MMOs lately is the fact you need to log on everyday to get anywhere. Dailies were a mistake.

That being said. I'm a functional (aka wagie) adult who only gets something like 1-2 hours a day to play games and I'm making decent progress in Guild Wars 2.';

'You need friends to play a mmo to the fullest but you play mmo's, because you have no friends.

Duality of man.';

'>>1243652
MMOs used to be a very easy and great way to make friends. It wasn't uncommon for me to end up with a full friend list after playing a new game for a month or two. People were just more social back then lol';

'>>1243551
I also downloaded that one, played for 15 mins but I get huge freezes when I move around the main city. I don't remember this happening in the real game. Anyway, I'm surprised by the amount of people playing I thought it would be deserted.';

'>>1243919
I played it for a while earlier today, and yeah for some reason the main city occasionally has 4-5 second freezes on my pc. My game even crashed twice in town while opening boxes from dungeons; I'm assuming it is because the game engine capped out at 8gb ram since it's an old game that'll sperg out if it tries to eat that much. After all, there was more RAM freely available...
I think those performance issues are caused by a custom cosmetic that a bunch of people are using given the nature of the crashes/freezes, especially since it's a private server. The game ran fine during dungeons, but I'm unsure if it'll handle raids well since I didn't get that far. Dungeons only used three people (including (You)), but it'll probably be okay since the town has a gorillion people compared to fights.

I can see why people missed Tera, but it doesn't stand out to me compared to other action MMOs that were around at the time. It's fun, but the original game had those content/"nothing to do" issues plus Korean gear-enhancing bullshit. From what I have seen, there appear to be two or three "big" Tera private servers; as far as I know, Menma and Starscape are the main ones on v100, while CZ runs an older version (v33/Gunner patch).';

'>>1217934
I'm playing the EU beta and its fun also its great to play a game that comes from the pre pozzed vidya era

>no type 2 body, full female with giant tits and bounce physics
>some enemies are literally nude girls that after being defeated bend over and you hack their body with a sickle to get materials

it feels like a time capsule of a more based era';

'>>1243990
I think the older versions of the game were more soulful and interesting. For me the appeal of TERA was always in the trifecta type of teamplay and leveling up with your buddies, doing those big ass monsters and dungeons. It really felt like an adventure. The late game raids and PVP was always unappealing to me. Well since I don't have buddies to play with anymore I'm not going to bother and I'm going to uninstall. Just wanted to see what it was like again.';

'>>1242931
>I genuinely believe MMORPGs should be regulated to be adult only like gambling, alcohol or nicotine.
Kids don't play MMOs now anyway.';

'>>1128802
>Seeking out a player, as a group, for revenge PK

Isn't PK the point of endgame in a good MMO?';

'In my quest trying to escape mazegame addiction I found that getting up from my pc at least once every 2 hours helps a lot.
Hope this is useful for someone else';

'>>1244842
Are you one of the subhumans that >>1242930 is talking about? I can't even sit down for that long without getting antsy and feeling the need to get up and at least stretch my legs.';

'>>1128802
>I've honestly considered joining Second Life just for the social interaction
as a second life """""""player""""""""", don't, social interaction is below 0 these days and people are in it just for the sandbox creations and furry porn and the furry porn is not that great either + you need to be skilled at mesh or texture making if you don't want to shell a ridiculous amount of cash to have cool shit

I only keep my account alive to pay a small rent fee for a friend of mine as payoffs for years of abuse from some californian schizo he got involved with';

'>>1245021
Wtf. It's people like you that make me realize that my life isn't so weird after all.';

'>>1245036
honestly my life is not that weird compared to the average 4chan ERP faggot';

'>>1242931
>I genuinely believe MMORPGs should be regulated
Life is an mmorpg';

'>>1245056
Fair. My life may be a pathetic hodge-podge of working full time for a hospital laundry facility, using that money to pay for my rent and groceries, fucking my fat GF on the reg, because I am also fat, but other than that I do okay.';

'>>1128837
honestly for me its the scale, its impressive to be a part of an event or raid with so many other players. its not about the direct interaction with them, more so the proximity to so many others working together. its like living in a big city for the "hustle and bustle".

this is why i cant seem to get into mmos though. i find the concept very impressive but i dont actually enjoy socializing with people online. i just want to play the cool endgame content and witness the scale, but i dont want to stick around and invest time into the people otherwise. I wish there were mmos that didnt require so much investment both timewise and commitment wise to play the best parts. i might sound like a complete tard, but thats why i like destiny (not nearly as big of scale as most mmos and doesnt even really qualify as an mmo i know) but you can just go on a LFG site, play the cool ass raid, while not needing to stay up to date with a fucking guild full of insufferable losers.';

'>>1245136
what sets an mmo apart from lfg shit like destiny for me is that in older mmos you could just waltz up to people in the open world or chat around to find or organize a party for something. that's a big deal for me. sure you could go to some website but you also had the option of doing it in the game itself. in destiny you can't do that, you always have to use the lfg because besides the tower, you literally cannot interact with or even see other players.';

'>>1245142
that makes sense. i suppose im not interested in mmos for the socialization so i actually prefer only interacting with players when i actually HAVE to. i dont use video games for socialization at all. it just feels shitty. ill play games with the people i know irl, but not for making new connections. seems like a waste of time.';

'define "functional*';

'My issue with MMOs these days are:
>Lack of immersive/roleplaying experiences
>They're solo experiences these days right down to having AI companions for dungeons if you want
So in the end I'm playing a lackluster solo RPG.';

'>>1249793
the modern mmo community is retarded and doesn't want much from the genre. the only reason many people play this is because "muh infinite gear progression". they're braindead, they play an mmo because of gear. they don't care if it's actually multiplayer or not. they're scum.';

'>>1249793
im having fun with albion, group content is at the forefront and if you are alone you are truly risking hard by going out since its full loot pvp

im not surprised that this mmo has completely filtered /v/ and /vg/, its the perfect blend of EVE and Runescape';

'many such cases';

'>>1201636
I want to like Albion and consistently play it, but whenever I do I think "why the fuck am I playing this" and end up playing OSRS or something. And you basically do need the membership to play the game, you literally get 2x the resources just for having a sub.';

'Its possible, but its exhausting. I just landed my first six figure job, and the saying the more money you make, the less time you have is absolutely true unless you're obscenely wealthy and can coast. After I get home, I workout, make dinner and collapse into a pile of shit and read a book for a few hours and its onto the next day.
Sometimes if I'm frisky, I'll get on BDO or something for 3-4 hours, but I'm almost 30 and realized recently how bad even missing a single hour of sleep fucks my whole day up.

Enjoy your neetdom if you have it, don't end up like me with people financially reliant on you.';

'mmos sales pitch was supposed to give a sort of living breathing world/community type of experience and they fail to do that
they're all theme parks and a lesser experience compared to a tailored single player rpg

you are better off playing survival games
games like: ark, rust, valheim, conan exiles';

'>>1253780
Maybe try not being a slave to someone but enslaving them instead dumbass?';

'Does anybody play SWTOR or Star Trek online ? I’ve been kind of wanting to try them the last couple weeks I just want a chill space game where I can maybe play with a couple other people and progress overtime I used to play a ton of MMO’s (like go on mmohut /bomb and play all those shitty suggestions) and quit around the time of warlords of draenor I remember I played swtor for maybe a month not even when it very first came out I was a poor high schooler and couldn’t talk my parents into paying subs and never tried SO';

'>>1253112
Albion is a prime example of how to make the most soulless game possible.';

'>>1213212
Any old MMORPG played now for the first time will give you a false perception of what the genre was back then. If you weren't there you won't get it and no amount of scouring through these old titles will fix that. You might superficially learn what the games are about but you won't know what it is like to truly experience an MMORPG. That experience is long gone.

>>1249793
You can thank WoW for that.';

'Is there a single mmo left that requires a party to level up and takes ages to hit cap? I want to get addicted to a game again bros';

'>>1256702
horizon ffxi private server? can't think of a single modern MMO like that.';

'>>1126066
>As I grew older and got my own freedom
I am 34 this year and still stuck with my parents as a poorfag. What is this "freedom" you describe?';

'>>1257974
People from good families and rich countries just amass wealth and income as they get older, so they think this is a natural process for everyone.';

'>>1123016
for a while, a lot of private mmo servers would customize things to let you skip most of the grind and it would just focus on gameplay. i really enjoyed playing those. but now all the private servers feel just as grindy as official.';

'>>1146670
i think the worse character is the heroic commander';

'I always think I want another MMO to get obsessed with but I don't think I'm capable of enjoying a video game that much anymore';

'You can't go back in time. You can't become a teenager again.';

'I'm enjoying city of heroes. So many bimbos';

'>>1259222
Wait till you run into Sexy Bimbo Goddess in Atlas Park/Pocket D.';

'Fairly late to posting this. There is a pre-alpha test for EverCraft Online going on till the end of the weekend. It is essentially EverQuest 1 transplanted into block graphics. It may look kind of jank, but the game feel of it is quite nice. Mobs hurt, take awhile to kill, an emphasis on partying.';

'>>1258748

Someone please make a time machine...';

'>>1123016
Lots of people in this thread brought up reasons such as the social aspect, timesinks, grinds, FOMO, etc... Here's mine.

I love to socialize online because I rarely get to IRL because of a hearing disability so that's how I got into MMOs from an early age. I've played so many over the years but I found the real reason many nowadays are incapable of keeping my attention for long, which is lack of character customization. If I want to socialize, I could do that anywhere else such as co-op games, but what I want out of an MMORPG is to create a unique character in a world of other unique characters.

MMOs nowadays have such limited player agency in how I could grow or play a character. Take FF14 for example. So many classes with cool themes. The setting allows so many archetypes to exist. But ultimately when I play one class, I am the same as thousands others playing the same class.

I want to play with a specific character in mind but I'm constantly limited by skill trees, the setting, pegged into roles, limited skill choices, gears, etc. It doesn't help that playing so many MMORPGs had me burned out on the tired cliche warrior/mage/rogue/cleric archetypes that I seem to feel a bit of disgust at seeing them in an MMORPG. I want an MMORPG that lets me create the class I have in mind and run with it but that means:

>has to have a massive number of abilities with the freedom to pick and use
>has to somehow be balanced with the incredible freedom of expression I have in mind
>has to somehow escape the holy trinity and let players do their thing
>the setting has to allow for a massive number of archetypes to exist so that means no strictly medieval fantasy or strictly sci fi, some setting that blends all those things (closest is a magi-tech setting with dimensional shenanigans)

After a while I concluded that no MMORPG can satisfy my admittedly unachievable criteria so I look elsewhere in different genres for more character customization freedom.';

'>>1260781
No, I think it's perfectly reasonable to ask for.

I'm not an "old good new bad" zombie. There are great modern indie games out there which even surpasses their predecessors (hell, even AA can be good). It's just the genre that is the problem. I think there's absolutely modern devs that WANT to make a game like this, but the cost of making such an MMO would need a gigacorp behind it. The ones that do have the money for it are soulless retards that make crap like instance themeparks or gachas. The demand is here, but the supplier is lobotomized.

Further complicating things: People don't know what they want. They say they want a maximum freedom sandbox but they don't. It's already been tried, and (most) people don't like it - EVE comes to mind. Those types of games generally devolve into low-trust PVP fiestas. I don't think that is a compelling story to play out in an RPG game. This is why it's so hard to make a really good MMO: If your game is too constrained, you feel like cattle being herded toward endgame, going through rides in a themepark, with no ability to carve out your own story. It becomes boring. If your game is too open, the game becomes filled with insufferable gankers and metagamers who couldn't care less about your gay roleplaying or story and turns your comfy rpg mmo into a PVP ghetto with nonstop drive-by shootings. This becomes boring too.

You have to constrain the game to give it meaning, but not so much that it becomes boring. The single most important factor of an MMO is to get this balance just right, and to my knowledge, not a single game has done so yet, let alone a modern MMO.

In fact, your greentext describes D&D perfectly; it's why it's such a compelling tabletop game. D&D gives you a nearly infinite set of actions to take, but a good DM will constrain you by nudging you toward the narrative. Problem is that modern videogames have largely failed to replicate this magic for years now, which is inexcusable.';

'>>1123016
There are no good MMOs these days. So, no.
If you enjoy them, you're not functional.
This might change if we get a good MMO again.';

'>>1123238
amazing how one man can make such a true post and a million people that are in denial about being somewhat of an outcast respond angrily, solidifying their point
>N-NO YOU BASTARD, MMOs were always for the cool people! I should know because I am le cool and I spent my life on them! You nerds ruined this!
MMORPG global chats remain like this to this day, just nerd on nerd hate.';

'>>1253112
>but whenever I do I think "why the fuck am I playing this"
I'm playing the EU launch and having a blast racing the jewish cartels that wanted to shill their overpriced mounts, tomorrow is day 3 and I have an entire island of oxes and horses to sell, I'll become a fucking millionaire woooooooooooo

that's the thing, in albion you make your own fun and your own goals, if you are used to shitty rollercoaster mmos like WoW or tranny wars 2 you won't have fun because there's no reail roading or directions, there's just the thrill of black zone shenanigans which is the most fun I've had since lineage desu';

'>>1149550
>It really depends on how lax the rules are in whatever MMO your playing, on most retail servers for western mmorpgs like WoW etc the rules are draconian tier

I still like Kmmos for this among other reasons';

'PSOBB, and to a lesser extent PSU or PSP2i are my go-to for a grindy game to play without a whole lot of set-up. Parties in PSO come together very quickly despite a relatively small amount of regular players. DQX and retail FFXI are very good and great to play at random times in shorter sessions.';

'>>1260699
>everything is blocks and character models are ugly as sin
>but spiders are just spiders
Is it too much to ask for compelling artstyle ffs? I don't even care for high definition 8k rtx shit, just something that is pleasant to look at and is internally consistent.';

'>>1149550
>>I used to play MMOs for the social aspect too but that's mostly gone these days. People who weren't there back then will protest "But I still socialize in MMOs all the time! You're just antisocial!" or some shit but they don't get how different it is.
>Alot of it has to do with faggot trannies, beta men, and ugly women taking over gaming
100% correct.
People who bemoan the loss of society in gaming and then blame it on the games fundamentally do not understand the issue. It isn't the game's fault. The problem is that people are simply worse now. There's been a general spiritual and social decay that make 99% of people horrible creatures not worth talking to, and it has a chilling effect on all social spaces.';

'>>1233497
Could it be that the experience of interacting with people online simply isn't interesting or novel anymore?
I was there in the early days. Simply booting up your computer, logging on, and saying hi to your friends felt exciting and intimate. Now it's a banality.';

'>>1260781
They have to make sure everything is "balanced" which means that every choice is essentially equivalent to every other choice. This is so that one single build doesn't become completely dominant over everything else, which in effect means everything ends up exactly the same and player choice becomes irrelevant.';

'>>1267613
Have fun regrinding your entire character from scratch because you clicked plus on stat one too many times or didn't know about breakpoints. Player choice is almost always about avoiding deliberate trap options.';

'>>1268481
>breakpoints
This is such terrible design. I know it's easier to design that way but it really screws people over if they don't plan things more meticulously.';

'>>1261182
You sound like an insufferable faggot.';

'Every single MMO thread on /vm/ plays out the same.
>everyone is always looking for a new mmo to play
>everyone always come to the conclusion that there is no good mmo';