'>>1153535
>There are also no meaningful progression/goals in these shooters, essentially you just camp around, rack up kills and don't really get anything for it, besides some xp/points that let you unlock cosmetics.
What more do you need? The gameplay is engaging enough that people will consistently play them. Unless you need a battlepass to fund your ADHD, or some shit progession system like CoD. Also yes OP, most FPS games are filled with cheaters now. Either get used to it or move on. FPS is pretty much dead.';

'>>1153711
>now
cheating has always been a thing and it was obvious too if you weren't a greenhorn
especially if the video maker that leaves hints is also the player :D:D:D

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1aAldANeXyM&t=277s
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NuOZ1_-4vdg&t=8s

I stopped playing Counter Strike because people were ghosting on public servers
in case it's not clear what ghosting is or some other definiton comes up it simply means that two people play together on a pub
one guy plays CT the other T while one guy just plays normally until he dies and "becomes the ghost"

the ghost then tells his friend where all his teammates are on the map essentially creating a wallhack without the use of additional software
the ghost is usually on the CT team because the T needs to plant the bomb while CT camp and wait for T to come

an easy way to counter this without admins, anticheat or some other meassure is to simply signal incorrect information to the ghost
information is only useful if it can be understood as such otherwise it becomes a liability';

'>>1154311
>greenhorn
So? I don’t need a nerd essay on ghosting. You should already know that there’s been a significant increase in the amount of players that blatantly cheat with walls/soft aim/aimlock. FPS is fucking dead. You’ll rarely find cheaters on games like HLL/Squad/Insurgency because generally they’re community hosted with admins that nip that shit in the bud. Either continue to play games with garbage matchmaking/company owned servers (like valorant/cs2/siege) and eat shit from cheaters or give those other games a chance. Dunno, just find another genre.';

'>>1153711
>What more do you need?
Something else to do besides just mindlessly shooting and dropping bodies without any satisfaction. I like the idea behind Tarkov a lot because it's not just an FPS, but also has basebuilding, crafting, looting, healing, gun building, etc, etc. But of course cheating faggots had to ruin all of that.';

'The gunplay/gameplay in HLL/Squad etc is also very unsatisfying because of how easy it is to just sit in some bush and kill entire hordes of situationally oblivious morons.';

'>>1153535
>The only shooters that I found have very few/almost no cheaters are HLL, Squad and Insurgency
aka you're an old retard who can only handle old retard games and anything with longer than a 1 shot ttk leaves you seething and coping about people being "cheaters" for being better.';

'>>1155116
If that's what you took away from my thread, then I'm sorry to say it, you have issues with reading comprehension. Retard.

Even if I encounter 1 cheater in 15 games at HIGH levels of play (and in a lot of these games in happens at a much higher frequency these days in higher ranks), the game is already ruined for me.';

'>>1155116
Braindead fucking faggot. Kys.';

'Someone once compared multiplayer games to riding a train packed with Indians, and every time these games come up in a conversation I can't get the picture of a train car jam-packed with stinky, unwashed, sweaty Indians out of my head.';

'>>1155129
So uh Indians live rent free in your head now? Lol';

'>>1155772
The analogy does. It's what makes me not want to ever touch another multiplayer FPS ever again.';

'>>1155978
It used to be a fun game, stupid /pol/tard brainlet. Kind of feel sorry for you because you consciously chose to miss out on one of the best shooters ever made because of some internet retardation.';

'>>1155995
Says some retarded nigger who never played bad company.';

'>>1156018
I have, but the gameplay in that game (destruction physics aside) is inferior to Bf1.';

'>>1155995
>stupid /pol/tard brainlet
lmao, mad at the people who want to gatekeep and segregate subhuman cheaters instead of the retards that are for the inclusion of everyone';

'>>1156211
Don't chime in if you're going to post some retarded shit completely unrelated to what's being discussed. Low IQ ape nigger faggot.';

'yea';

'>>1153535
Soon it's not just going to be FPS games, AI assisted input is going to ruin every genre of online game. Basically playing with anyone other than people you know is kill unless you wanna be farmed by cheaters.';

'Just play doom eternal, or any other single player fps, try to complete them on higher difficulties, but if this is not good enough for you because you're killing ai and not players then unfortunately gaming may very well be dead in your eyes, if this is the case, get a new hobby';

'>>1153535
no? who gives a shit if you die to a cheater 1/100 games lol';

'>>1155978
>>1155995
>>1156018
>>1156024
You're both retarded niggers. First of all, you're debating which EA game is better, which would be like arguing over what tires you should have while driving over lava. Second, you dumbfucks are playing battlefield after 2005, gtfo. I fucking hate casuals and their gay Xbox games so fucking much, die already. Vaccinate and die, jfc.';

'>>1160935
>Pic related';

'>>1160935
No one asked for a retarded boomer's input. Check yourself into a retirement home already and get suffocated with a pillow by a nigger, you absolute waste of oxygen.';

'>>1161207
poorfag';

'>>1162796
Who asked you to introduce yourself';

'>>1162803
nice melty';

'>>1162842
you lost the argument, get over it loser';

'>>1162903
I'm sorry, kid, I wasn't aware there was an "argument".';

'>>1153535
Many of the old games now have contact information for the active admin in the motd and displayed in game. Just text them if there is a problem.';

'>>1155102
HLL is an arcade shooter, as for Squad, find better teammates, join communities in discord. I don't wish random pub matches on anybody.';

'>>1153535
it's a two fold problem.
with youtube and twitch tricking many people into thinking they can make a career off of playing video games, especially FPSs, and most people being incredibly dull, what they do instead of having a personality, is dedicating an autistic amount of time to getting good at a game, of course this means they become turbo autists and tryhard in every match.
now, when someone isn't getting good at a game, but desperately wants to, or is already good, but feels they are owed more, they get cheat software to make themselves seem even better.
mind you, many "pro" players are hackers.
of course companies like ubisoft don't actually care, cheaters are allowed to run rampant, get banned a few months after detection so that way the cheater feels like they can get another few months of cheating out of a new account, pay ubisoft another 20 dollars for siege and the cycle repeats.
if something intuitive isn't done about cheating in the next few years, multiplayer is going to become unplayable.';

'>>1165340
worst part is, an anti-cheat software that could auto-detect and ban instantly is stupidly easy to implement, but again, cheaters = new accounts
>aimbot/no recoil.
this one is incredibly easy to detect. snapping to someone's head without even a hint of over aim, no deviation in the reticle as the gun is being fired.
mind you, you can account for a lucky flick when it isn't consistently happening. and everyone has recoil, even the most pro player doesnt have 100% accuracy.
the sheer fact that auto-bans for this stuff isn't in effect is a clear sign that game companies just dont care.';

'>>1165340
>if something intuitive isn't done about cheating in the next few years, multiplayer is going to become unplayable.
But wait, it gets worse: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lbs0Ld5Wff0 like, how do you even do anything about this type of shit? It's impossible to detect.

Radar is already pretty much impossible to detect because radar hackers commonly use two PC's, one for playing the game and another one for reading the data from the game and visualizing said data. And some use hacking HARDWARE to cheat using the double PC method as well, where they plug an aimbot card into their second PC and let it do all the shooting and aiming for them, all without being detected. This shit is a fucking nightmare and absolutely out of control. A lot of streamers who can afford dual rigs do this type of shit all the time too.';

'>>1165421
depending on how the AI plays, if it's too perfect, like i said in >>1165343 software can easily detect inhuman movement
if the AI has a decent margin of error, it may just as well play like a high level player, which isn't impossible to beat, just annoyingly hard.
however, i see the games industry going 1 of 2 ways
>cheating becomes such a massive issue without a good solution that multiplayer effectively dies and we get a resurgence of single player
though given how greedy companies are, they'll probably either go to subscription based (like WOW) or make you pay a certain amount of money for an allotted time frame to play.
>companies finally put serious development into anti-cheat
this last one is unlikely, as the tech to auto-detect cheating is readily available, but banning cheaters too fast deincentivizes them to buy burner accounts.
we're in a soft video game crash right now, the market is over saturated with half built games, but people are too bored to not buy them. I think cheating will be the lynch pin that had crashes the industry if we don't go back to multiplayer centric market.
though to be honest, i've become tired of most multiplayer games, thanks to twitch making every retard who thinks they're entertaining tryhard every match all day.';

'>>1165472
i think cheating will be the lynch pin that crashes the industry if we dont go back to campaign centric market*';

'>>1153535
Yeah, it's a scourge.
Shooter games are heavily affected, but that's not to say other genres aren't affected either.
There are no solutions in sight, it's depressing.';

'>>1165475
there are solutions, just none that profit companies.
banning cheaters is banning paying customers for cosmetics';

'>>1165472
>>1165474
Yeah, I think online multiplayer is going to die in the next decade, because it's a constant cat and mouse game that game devs just can't keep up with. Aren't competent enough to keep up with. Don't have enough resources or time to keep up with. There's even a saying that's been going around the past couple years or so: "game devs need to find a million ways (of stopping cheats) and cheat makers only need to find one way (of making their cheat work).

I think what we're going to see is a resurgence of LAN gaming. Instead of playing online people will start going to internet cafes to play with other living breathing human players more often. And honestly, I'm not opposed to it at all, I'd welcome that change with open arms. LAN gaming NEEDS to make a comeback.';

'>>1165482
i grew up on the tail end of LAN gaming, it was good.
LAN cafe's would 100% take off if/when online multiplayer dies.
you know what? accelerate the problem, more cheating.';

'>>1165486
I was looking at some gaming centers in my city on google the other day and they never actually went away. People still go to these places to play with others via LAN. Shit's crazy. It made me want to go to one of these places and pay for a 6-8 hour session just so I can play with people I'm 100% confident aren't cheating lol, and actually enjoy playing a multiplayer game for once.';

'>>1165493
soon LANbro, soon.
with the proliferation of tech, i can see LAN cafes opening up even in smaller towns.
especially with emulators, you could host any number of coop/multiplayer games.';

'>>1153535
Yep. After a 10 year hiatus, I just built a gaming pc only to find out multiplayer games are unplayable now. Going to sell my parts.

Public online multiplayer requires people to exercise some goodwill in order for it to work. it was possible in the past because gamers mostly came from middle class western households where cheating would have been considered shameful. This type of person outnumbered malicious users 10 to 1.

Fast forward to today: Honest users are a minority. The median user now is low IQ, in poverty, and comes from a culture where cheating is not looked down upon as it is in the West. Region locking isn't effective anymore because of the massive amounts of garbage culture thriving Western regions. Add "streamer culture" on top of this, which creates a financial incentive for winning in multiplayer games, and the situation just becomes fucked. There is no going back to how things used to be.

I plan to dissuade as many people as possible from building a gaming PC for multiplayer games. It's an expensive mistake. And for people coming over from consoles, it's easy to take a playable multiplayer environment for granted.';

'>>1165553
you can thank the popularity of let's plays, twitch and youtube live streaming for the competitive state of multiplayer.
if you arent try as hard as you can even in casual, you aren't a real gamer and no one will watch you.
hence why people like mintblitz (some faggy aussie halo youtuber) specifically goes into matches with low skill players so he can get those sweet clips of him totally destroying other players.';

'>>1153535
>Pretty good at shooters
>Haven't really played in a couple months though
>Decide to boot up Hunt Showdown
>Literally my first game derusting has someone comment on my profile accusing me of blatantly hacking
I don't want to sound like I'm just talking shit or something but I find it genuinely hard to take people seriously when they doompost about hackers given how often I've been accused of it even when I thought I was playing poorly.';

'>>1165553
>Going to sell my parts.
Why though? Just play singleplayer games/VR/whatever. Believe it or not, but multiplayer games make up only a tiny fraction of all games.

>"streamer culture" on top of this
It's not only streamer culture. People make real life money by cheating. They either sell "carry" services to useless shitters who want to rank up, but don't realize that might face the exact same cheater carrying them an hour from then, OR cheaters literally kill players and steal their rare/valuable in-game items from them and then sell those items to other players for real money, like in Tarkov. It's a multi-million dollar industry at this point. And selling hacks is probably a multi-billion dollar industry.';

'>>1165576
that's because the hackers are on games like siege, apex legends, and other more popular stuff.';

'>>1165576
like 10 years ago nobody cared if some shitter cried cheater
with random lobbies you can't filter as well now and with cheating becoming a huge business during covid, especially in china, you can expect any slightly popular game getting premium cheats and people buying those cheats
like battle bits got cheats in a month after it became popular, you had shit like chang flying above everyone with an lmg and headshotting the entire team and that's just the blatant thing
once you have these every few games you will settle into the mindset of people cheating
that guy blasting you the second you turned a corner? Wallhack.
No he couldn't have saw you coming this way, or had that corner locked down, or maybe heard your footsteps, nah he is cheating
and the sad truth is that he probably is, I've seen some pretty serious stuff like full on ballistics computing, how do you even tell the difference between someone sniping you at 500m being a cheater or being skilled if you don't even get a killcam?

and the worst part is that the people who benefit the most from cheats are the ones that already know how to play well, imagine knowing beforehand which battles to take, where to set up to ambush an enemy, etc., you just can't fight back';

'>>1166212
The one thing I don't get is... what sort of mental gymnastics do these scumfucks have to engage in to convince themselves that using cheats somehow makes them good at the games they cheat in? I don't care how much map or game knowledge you have, if you cheat, you have a massive skill issue and it automatically makes you a fucking shitter.

The other day I came across this cheating faggot's channel on youtube (filled with videos of him cheating), and he was crying in one of his vids about valve manually banning him and saying shit like "I EDIT MY VIDEOS TO MAKE IT SEEM LIKE I'M HACKING, IT'S JUST A PRANK BRO, I'VE NEVER CHEATED IN MY ENTIRE LIFE, VALVE PLS UNBAN". Without a hunt of sarcasm or irony. These motherfuckers huff some grade A copium, it's unreal. They've convinced themselves that the software they use is a normal part of the game and it's fair to use it, and that they're just naturally better than everyone else.';

'>>1166371
Theres no true testing ground or passage of right for life anymore in such a highly connected world, just psuedo hyper competitive pyramids involving thousands to millions of players of which only a few of us will ever reach the top. Most of the people playing these competitive games want self validation and when they cant to get to #1 through skill (as 99% of us wont in such open pools) their poorly developed egos cant handle it. Many have no other successes in life to draw on, so success in the game becomes paramount to maintaining their ego and they will rationalize all sorts of behaviour to get it (a common one ive seen is "everyone higher rank is cheating so im just doing what it takes." )

To point out cheating in another genre, EvE online, it has nominal twitch based skills involved unlike a fps, and its a single remote server making it hard to "hack". Instead, because combat and other things in game are more simplistic, multiboxing has become incessant and unescapable, to the point where it has ruined much of the competitve nature of the game.';

'nigger';

'>>1166371
same "people" who immediately pull out their phone to "play" some garbage mobile game or check social media
they don't like the game or the gameplay, they just care that they can say that they are doing "it"';

'Taken from plebbit, but where's the lie? This wipe for about a week I kept finding valuable loot EVERYWHERE, it felt like the game just constantly threw cash at me. And the moment cheaters updated their cheats and I started dying in sussy ways all the time again, the loot has become complete shit. Raid after raid I couldn't find a single item worth above, say, 30k per slot, whereas previously I was constantly finding 50-200k slot items all the time. Fuck this shit.';

'>>1166789';

'>>1166793';

'>>1153535
Bots are the only players I dislike.
I love when half the team suicides over and over to force the game to end ASAP and earn a small participation prize. Keep the script running all month and you can craft a gun to sell on eBay with those quick losses.';

'Is there a reason they removed the death replay in CSGO 2? It's easier for cheaters to get away with hacking if there's no replay, so maybe Valve did it to hide their cheating issue.';

'>>1168006
Is there a reason they removed 90% of shit from CSGO? The game isn't even in a beta state, they straight up stripped it from features and rolled out a half-assed alpha build.';

'>>1168022
of features*';

'>>1168022
I haven't really noticed any differences because I ragequit the game after a few hours. They didn't want to compete with CSGO (which was a complete game) so they got rid of it. They had their largest drop in players in a decade.';

'>>1168062
Ooof, lol. I think this is the first time in 5-6 years (since PUBG came out) that I open steamcharts and CSGO/CS2 isn't at the very top of the list.';

'>>1168067
>hours played still better
apparently making such a dogshit game that the player immediately closes it won't get you top in every category';

'>>1168090
I think CS2 uses CSGO's stats, so those hours played = 10 years+. Whereas Palword has only been out for what, like 2 weeks?';

'I don't care, maybe if games weren't built to be ultra-competitive skinner boxes people wouldn't cheat as much. Okay, it's inevitable in some games like Tarkov, but for instance in two thousand hours of TF2 cheaters were rare enough to be a novelty. Maybe it's because if you can't win the game through hitting headshots all the time, you can contribute with one of the other 8 classes. Maybe it's not important that you win, and whatever you do doesn't sandbag the team effort enough because you've got 11 teammates. Or maybe your enjoyment derives from the social interaction that grows much more organically in a server. The industry shat the bed, they're not going to clean it up, and newcomers to the genre can't conceive of anything other than a shitty bed.';

'>>1168598
>in two thousand hours of TF2 cheaters were rare enough to be a novelty.
lol
lmao';

'>>1168598
>two thousand hours of tf2
>cheaters were rare enough
this is sarcasm right? or are you just really new to pc gaming.
if you want a cheater free fps experience play quake otherwise just deal with it';

'Some people are just so bad at shooters, they wouldn't be able to tell cheaters apart from good players in a million years. Pretty sad desu.';

'>>1169160
>>1169183

This was before the bots happened. I played on a few community servers that had decent mods. Any time someone shady showed up he was quickly votebanned. If you haven't been in servers like those, you don't know what you missed.

And as a bonus, you'd also make friends in servers like that. It did take a little searching, but it's miles better than the dogshit that's been standardized in the genre today.';

'These threads remind me of the gangstalking threads on /x/';

'>>1169294
>I have 2k hours if tf2, there are basically no cheaters
>btw I also only play on a few moderated community servers

yes, votekick and actual servers instead of a matchmaker helps with the problem, but even back then cheating was common enough, not as bad as now, but still an issue
currently the big problem is lack of moderation, getting matched with completely random people from who knows where and a huge financial incentive to both cheat and make cheats, with cultural norms breaking down due to an influx of subhumans';

'Console was the way to escape cheaters, but now everything is crossplay...
>Turn crossplay off
no games found';

'I have 1600 hours in CSGO and I was consistently the top of the leaderboard for every match then when CS2 came out I started getting beaten by noobs who don't even know the map. I am now lucky to be in the top 5 on the leaderboard. Was the timing for the guns changed? And why do I seem to be getting one-shot more often.';

'>>1170038
Console has cheats now too. There are hardware aimbots with AI that you can plug into anything that will aim and control recoil for you. And it's undetectable, because it doesn't run directly on your PC/console/whatever. Besides, console has had m+kb players shitting all over gamepad users for years.';

'>>1170073
timing of when your shot goes off is way faster so you have to have your crosshair directly onto your target when you click';

'>>1170300
>now
I remember using a m+kb converter because I absolutely hate the controller for fps like a decade ago.
And you could still play multiplayer on an unlocked console. Xbox live could ban your acc, but you could just make another.
Cheating was just harder back then, but you could still do it on console.';

'Do you think this could be solved by the re-emergence of self-hosted servers rather than centralized hosting servers provided by the producers of the games? Presumably if you play with a tightknit group of people that have mutual trust, you don't need to worry about cheaters? Also that actually can have good performance gains by allowing more simulation to happen on the client side, if the client can be trusted to do physics calculations rather than their inputs being verified by the server.';

'>>1174657
There's a reason the games I listed as free of cheaters all have community hosted servers with active admins. Yes, that's unironically the only way to defeat cheaters in multiplayer shooters. No community servers = cheaters galore. Simple as.';

'>>1174657
It should be both mm at the same time, community servers could spiral into closed off spaces where new players can't join at all. I have been banned/vote kicked from servers where I did a little too good for their liking, and seen it happen to other too.
It might be possible to implement some system that forces you to give a reason for ban, so you can't just ban anyone you don't like, but mass reports are already abused, and most games have absolutely insane rules.

The true solution would be remove anyone east of Europe and anyone below the equator. Aussies and japs are way too far to have good connection anyway.';

'Thanks Anons!
>>1174753
What do you think about designating referees? Would that help, even in the case of centralized servers?

>>1174810
>community servers could spiral into closed off spaces where new players can't join at all.
That point is well made, and I think it illustrates part of why the self-hosted ecosystems have been discarded over time.
>but mass reports are already abused
This part is a perplexing question that I've tried to work out for a long time. The same system that attempts to ban those with ill intent, is easily abusable by the same sorts of people.
>The true solution would be remove anyone east of Europe and anyone below the equator.
The solutions (that I can think of) to this are I think are tricky and have problems:
1. Geolocate people in the world to make them join servers in their location.
P1. The user just fakes their IP using a VPN or alternate solution. Which would degrade their ping and connection even further.
2. Could just blanket ban anyone who doesn't have a low enough ping.
P2. This would probably be easiest to implement and the 'fairest'. However, it sucks to not only not have a good ping, but also to be just flat out banned for not having a good ping. I've been there with a poor connection in my youth, and I can sympathize.
3. Some sort of real-world ID verification system where you have to provide additional data to make an account to begin with.
P3. While this could be very effective, I find this to be a distasteful breech of personal privacy and anonymity.';

'>>1175135
it takes minimal effort to go through the most popular vpns and blacklist their servers, even just the free ones';

'>>1175244
Fair enough. Presumably some actors would find their way around that, but filtering the vast majority I'd count as a win.
What do you think about sorting people even further in terms of geographical location? If player count was high enough not to be a consideration, how small should the areas end up?';

'>>1175321
You'll never get 100%, even official tournaments have cheating, all it takes is a few seconds.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jhjuj9C52U4

I would be against region locks, but it's undeniable that certain regions are way overrepresented in cheating. The only other issues I have is communication, but this could be solved by having a context menu, and high ping, I think over 200ms ping over a longer period of time should at least get you flagged as unstable connection.';

'>>1175502
>You'll never get 100%
Indeed, I think the hope is severe mitigation but complete removal is probably impossible.

>I would be against region locks
What about optional region locks? As in the user can decide themselves if they'd like to be in the Global pool, National pool, Regional pool, etc.?';

'>>1175518
Anything smaller than the EU would fuck up shit as most countries simply don't have the population to support individual servers, and fragmenting the player base is bad to begin with.
Optional is pointless, it's like cross play enable on current console games, console only is basically dead. The smaller pool eventually dries up.';

'>>1175135
>designating referees
I don't think it's practical, unless it's a volunteer driven effort (which also would have its problems). Not even a company like ubisoft could ever afford to hire enough "referees" to spectate every single match in their games that have 50-100k+ concurrent players.';

'>>1175653
Certainly not paid referees provided by the producers of the game. Also I agree, volunteer referees are probably a bad idea just like volunteer forum mods, and even worse volunteer Jannies. But, like the other Anon had mentioned, it does seem like older games were able to manage this sometimes with a bit of honest moderators (fuckers did it for free!).
Let me flesh out my idea a bit, and how it might be achievable. Forgive my rambling.
1. Take hints from the moderation that used to work in individual servers and leverage that where possible. Basically allow for self-hosted games to exist alongside a monolithic system.
2. Possibly randomly select a referee from the current group that is playing. This can also be used to balance an otherwise unbalanced game. In addition, some decent in game currency or reward could be gained from providing an honest service.
3. This probably works better in small-sided games that have quick rounds. Nobody probably wants to log in and ref a 60 minute game that they have no opportunity to play in, but being the ref for a 5 minute round in that 60 minute total might be reasonable.
4. Provide some actual interesting interactions for the ref that don't exist for a normal player, but aren't abusive.
4a. Perhaps the ref gets to chose the music for the round as well, so they double as the DJ.
4b. The ref also could set up a sort of replay system to highlight moments in the game that were particularly skillful and/or funny.
4c. Give the ref a real physical presence in the game field, so they aren't just a disembodied ghost, but a feel like a real part of the game to begin with.
4d. Unique model, emotes, whistle sound effects, the works.
5. I hate to mention this dead horse, but this is a perfect application for AI to step in when humans don't care to be the ref.
5a. Multiple different types of strict/forgiving refs that have different personalities.';

'>>1175676
>allow for self-hosted games to exist alongside a monolithic system
This alone would be great honestly. And not just self-hosted games, but entire self-hosted servers with their own admins. Imagine a game like Tarkov, but with private servers? Or even a game like Siege, CoD, etc. CS2 has community servers in addition to official matchmaking right? And so does Insurgency Sandstorm. Stuff like that can definitely be implemented in other games, it all really comes down to whether each individual dev wants something like that in their game, and I think multiplayer games are only worse for not giving players the ability to rent/host their own servers. Besides, sooner or later the devs will have to pull the plug on the official servers, and community servers ensure that games don't fully die for potentially decades after.';

'If it's not cheaters, it's the fact that despite it somehow being 2024 devs still think that any tick rate under 120hz is at all acceptable and also want to have mOvEmEnT so that ADHD kids can wear out the control keys on their keyboards sliding around everywhere giving themselves disjointed hitboxes that you can't counter because the server can't keep up with what the characters are capable of.';

'>>1175688
I agree wholeheartedly. Sad when games close down and a handful of dedicated fans and coders try their best to raise something from the ashes that should've been shared with them simply because of their loyalty. I even think some sort of gentleman's agreement to release the source code within a certain timeline after development stops would do a great deal to bring back trust into this industry.';

'>>1175702
This can be achieved better by allowing clients to be trusted to provide physics calculations for their own characters. But that allows for cheaters to even more easily manipulate the system.';

'>>1175702
Also can you provide examples of games that have this problem (tick rate and/or disjointed movement)? I'm admittedly out of date when it comes to modern games. Would appreciate the learning opportunity, and to see what not to do.';

'>>1175710
>his can be achieved better by allowing clients to be trusted to provide physics calculations for their own characters
Arma does this but Arma is simulating so much stuff at a client and server level that it has to. Most games do not need to do this, the server just has to be set to run at a higher tick rate. It usually isn't set to run at that tick rate because niggers and spics running the game from their console wifi would get outclassed by literally anyone with a wired connection every time at higher tick rates, and higher tick rates are more likely to expose bad netcode, and since the industry is full of hacks these days, no one can write good netcode.

>>1175713
Pretty much any game with mOvEmEnT techniques like Apex/Titanfall, all of the Modern Warfare remakes, Fortnite, Battlefield for a while (they actually fixed this somewhat). If pressing ctrl puts you into a slide there's a good chance the game operates like this.';

'>>1175720
Appreciated.
>running the game from their console wifi would get outclassed by literally anyone with a wired connection
Well fuck them, they can get with the picture or get used to sucking.
>If pressing ctrl puts you into a slide there's a good chance the game operates like this.
Do you think that those types of movement could be acceptable in a higher tickrate environment? Or should those be avoided?';

'>>1175676
The referee would presumably have access to the entire game state? How would you prevent favoritism? If he was on discord with his friends, what would prevent him from sharing information with them? Could he just ban whoever he didn't like?';

'>>1165343
>>1165472
>>1165477
>worst part is, an anti-cheat software that could auto-detect and ban instantly is stupidly easy to implement
Where are you getting this information? Preventing cheating is notoriously difficult. Simple cases, sure, but any moderately advanced hack is a bitch to detect. There simply isn't a ready solution that you can just drop into a game, that would be a meaningful deterrent.';

'>>1175756
Some of these questions vary wildly depending on whether or not the game is hosted by individuals, or by the producer of the game. I'll address the latter because I think that is what you're more concerned with, and the former is similar to mods on self-hosted games already (who certainly sometimes do abuse their power).
>The referee would presumably have access to the entire game state?
Well kinda because in my example it would be more or less a player/spectator with additional privileges. That doesn't mean that the ref would be able to modify any variable if that is what you mean. But possibly has tools to help detect anomalies in movement or play by various players. Maybe has a yellow/red card like system to punish players but allow them to stop cheating before being kicked.
>How would you prevent favoritism?
Well that is a tough one even in real life sports and I'm not sure I have a perfect answer. Obviously much more difficult if the game is say 8v8 and one team is made up of buddies on Discord, and one of those ends up as the ref. This could be tackled partially by pulling in an outside individual from a pool rather than one from team A or B. Though nothing says this person wouldn't pick a favorite team. Or perhaps by having more than one ref.
>Could he just ban whoever he didn't like?
This also is a tough one and has real life parallels. I've seen people booted off fields by refs that didn't deserve it, but irked the ref in a way he didn't like. Perhaps some method of arbitration if the ref misbehaves? But then we're in a "who watches the watchers" situation and there are many who would blame the ref after a loss.

All good and pertinent questions, though I'm not sure I have good answers. As well as I'm still hesitant to say that this is the 'correct' approach to deal with cheaters anyhow.';

'>>1175810
I appreciate how you're putting effort into the issue, but I think you're simply reinventing admins and private servers, here.
LoL used to have a community-driven system for judging player reports, the Tribunal. Perhaps it would be an interesting data point for you. From my understanding, one of the problems was that the judges tended to disproportionately favour the guilty verdict.';

'>>1175832
I had like a thousand cases, and yeah, people can't be trusted with moderation on a community scale, but I think on individual level it is possible. Also, lol is extremely toxic, in the actual sense of the word, you are locked into a team with 4 retards and you are supposed to wrangle them to victory.';

'>>1153535
Play on Xbox';

'>>1175502
>theScore esports
lol';

'>>1175832
Appreciate you and your responses as well Anon. And you're right about this being very close to private servers and administration.
>LoL used to have a community-driven system for judging player reports, the Tribunal.
Been a while since I played LoL, I think I quit when they were first rolling out the tribunal system. I will look into if they did some sort of post mortem of that solution.

>>1175851
>... but I think on individual level it is possible
Hope springs eternal.';

'>>1155129
>Someone once compared multiplayer games to riding a train packed with Indians
elaborate please';

'>>1175997
I assume they compare playing single player games to riding first class. There's no one to get in the way of your enjoyment there, there's no one to bother you, the train car is empty, you can occupy two seats or 10 if you really wanted to, you're free to enjoy yourself any way you want. You can jerk off, watch a movie, play a game on your handheld, drink yourself into a stupor. It's Man vs Game. But multiplayer is a different type of conflict. It's Man vs Man. A packed, cramped, stinky, stuffy train full of annoying brown people who pile on top of each other, elbow each other, bite, spit and smear snot and shit on each other, climb over each other, just so they could feel at least somewhat more comfortable than the others, but never comfortable enough.';

'>>1174753
>There's a reason the games I listed as free of cheaters all have community hosted servers with active admins
Yeah because if you're too good then you get banned too. It'd be easy to make an 'effective' AC if you barely had to give a fuck about false positives and could just ban anybody whose regularly clowning on a server or looks suspicious enough.';

'>>1176132
I think in real life they call that equity these days.';

'>>1175702
you cannot just force high tick rates onto servers because retarded children cannot run the game well which is also a dev issue but also just a console fag issue
and even if you got past all that bullshit just assuming you are a indie dev basically no one will play your shit ignoring server costs which would make your game alone in the red
multiplayer fps games are in a shit state which they have devolved and have turned mentally retarded so children and idiots can feel good about themselves

if every game really showed players their actual skill level they would go back to playing movie shit instead of running in the hamster wheel for the next battlepass update';

'>>1176770
>multiplayer fps games
multiplayer games';

'I cheat on dayz with cheats that cost 60 dollars a month, a vpn that costs 30 a month, and I spend about 40 a month on accounts

Nothing will stop me, it’s too much fun.

The sense of control. My favorite thing to do is to go deep into the map, like where it takes hours for a regular player to progress to, and then kill them.

You can’t stop me.';

'@1176973
I cheat on your mother with your sister, while you're stuck acting like a massive faggot in your autistic survival games, nerd.';

'if only there was some way to have individual servers moderated in real time...';

'>>1179489
That's about the only solution. It's not 100% foolproof, but it's way more effective than reporting cheaters and so-called "anicheats" (useless bloatware).';

'How about joining or owning a private server? Sure it could take a while to get a community put together to play together on a regular basis, but it would be worth it in the long run to know a bunch of people who want to play the same game(s) as you.';

'>>1179524
The issue is that a lot of games simply don't give players the ability to host custom servers. Some older games have LAN, and you can totally build a community around hosting LAN games online (via something called Radmin VPN), but even that doesn't guarantee there won't be any cheaters if you don't moderate your community properly. There are a few discord servers where people play older versions of R6 Siege (seasons like White Noise, Blood Orchid, etc) via LAN, and the biggest server that hosts these games is absolutely plagued by cheaters because the admins simply don't give a fuck. In fact, I've heard stories of people freely sharing cheats right in that discord server and some of the "devs" and mod makers close to the admins are known cheaters as well. If you're going to create a server for people to play games via LAN, just don't be a lazy faggot and actually actively ban and blacklist cheaters.';

'>>1153535
>ruined
No they've improved them. You are expected to be cheating otherwise you are disadvantaging yourself.
If you aren't cheating your team will be disappointed in you.
Cheating is more fun and more competitive.';

'>>1179526
But that's the flip side of private servers, isn't it? Such a server can have any culture the mods want, including allowing cheats. And that's fine too, it just means that server isn't for you.';

'>>1179490
Anti-cheats are unfortunatley necessary as it's the difference between having to buy a cheat from some Chinese guy and little Timmy being able to look up "How to Scriptkiddy your first Aimbot" on Youtube and it just working for him.';

'>>1180165
damn imagine if the average hacker was as easy to detect as a ten year old script kiddie following a youtube tutorial because that's what he was

really glad we have a global industry with a profit incentive instead';

'>>1180111
Sure, if they advertise it as such.';

'>>1180167
You have to have no idea how cheating works since most cheats have to actually bypass the anti-cheat one way or another.

The only way to do true anti-cheat is at the kernel level which is dangerous because it means if anyone does make a cheat that bypasses it, it becomes immediatley a threat to your PC.';

'>>1180165
Many cheats can be blocked server side if the devs know what they're doing.';

'>>1180170
>the kernel level which is dangerous because it means if anyone does make a cheat that bypasses it, it becomes immediatley a threat to your PC
...No, when you're making a cheat, you're trying to bypass the anti-cheat installed on your computer. So it is technically true that such a cheat can be dangerous for you, but it's simply because you're running suspicious programs on your PC. Anti-cheat doesn't really have anything to do with it.

What is dangerous is when somebody figures out a security flaw in an anti-cheat in a way that allows them access to somebody else's computer. Then you're in deep shit, and this is why kernel anti-cheats are dangerous. But it's a completely different vector of attack. Most cheats try to bypass the local anti-cheat so they can run benevolently (for the cheater), whereas a hack would compromise a remote anti-cheat to use it maliciously.';

'>>1179607
>no Video Games/Furry board
coomer bros... it's over';

'>>1179488
Learn to reply, you bum.

Still wasting people’s time on dayz, and it’s more fun when people like you get mad.';

'@1180943
Still fucking your mom, you credit card gamer. Couldn't care less about DayZ, it's genetic losers like you who think they're hot shit while wasting entire fortunes on crutches in video games that amuse me. You will never be good, never forget this.';

'No. FPS was always shit.';

'>>1181385
Fortune? It’s cheap, you must be a broke wagie.

And I am good. Nothing you can do can stop me, I always win';

'>wagie
Having access to your mommy's credit card doesn't make you rich, credit card gamer kid. You have achieved nothing, except waste your parents' money, and you never will.

Lmao at "I am good". No one who cheats is good, you massive shitter. You will always suck at the games you cheat in, literal bot.';

'>>1182136
Not true.

I always win, especially in Dayz.
Awwww, you made it to the bunker with your specially whittle punch card? Thank you for getting that for me.
Awww, you got a ghille suit? Thanks for crafting that for me, I’ll make sure to headshot you with this sporter so I don’t ruin it.
Awwww, you looted the gas zone for an m4? Thanks, I really like m4s with dual mags.

Night time? No problem, always day [on].
Need food? No problem, Food esp [on].
Bored? No problem, entity esp, all [on].

Only time I die is when i clear Tisy or whatever other end game location there is and want to go back to the coast to troll noobs.

The cheats do make me good, and you suck for not using them.';

'Nah, you don't win anything. You play the game on tutorial mode. I wouldn't even consider it "playing", honestly. You're the type of guy who plays games like Dark Souls with cheat engine and god mode. You just suck at games and go around telling everyone about it, like it's something to be proud of. I can guarantee you, everyone knows you cheat, they can tell you cheat, and no one thinks you're good, the moment you kill another player with cheats they think "what a sad genetic failure loser who needs cheats not to get his ass kicked in this game lmao". That's who you are. A gimp. You're a gimp.';

'I play games for the sense of accomplishment. What does a cheater accomplish? Nothing. You're a loser. A nobody. No one will ever think you're good and everyone will always pity you for being a sad cripple who needs crutches in video games.';

'>>1182445
>>1182460

Ahhahahaha, the tears taste sweet.

Everyone I play with never suspect a thing. Quite the contrary, everyone wants to play with me and team up, I am superior to non cheaters.

Imagine not cheating on a game that doesn’t matter.

Awwww, you train your aim? I don’t, just hold mouse4.

Awww, you spent hundreds of dollars on expensive mice and keyboards and monitors? I play on a laptop with a 5 dollar wireless mouse.

Dayz, counter-strike, siege, ANY GAME I PLAY I WIN and beat LOSERS like you!

Seethe shitter, seethe harder';

'>>1155101
>like the idea behind Tarkov a lot because it's not just an FPS,
heh';

'>>1182377
kek

>>1182486
Imagine being this shit at life in general.. you can't cheat at actual skills. What do you do then? Cry?';

'>>1182565
You can cheat at everything, I’m about to graduate uni with a 4.0 because of chat gpt and cheating. Seethe loser.

Winners cheat, losers cry like bitches make excuses and lose.';

'@1182486
You suck at games. End of story. Never convincing anyone otherwise now. The moment you touched a cheat you basically admitted to being bad at games. You will always be a sucker. And everyone will 100% always know you cheat and do it because you have skill issues. People know you do it, they know exactly why you do it. Because you're a skilless shitter.';

'>>1183380
I . Still. Win.

Seethe harder, loser.';

'@1183413
You can't win if you're not even playing the game. Cope, loser.';

'Let me tell you what winning looks like: it's killing a 4-5 man team all by yourself, then looting all of their bodies and taking their shit and walking away with a sense of accomplishment. Without aimbot. Without wallhacks. Without radar cheats. Can you imagine doing that? No, you can't. Because you'll never be that good in your life. The emotional rollercoaster, the adrenaline that you get from killing entire teams of real players, you'll never know it. All you do is toggle your software, and it does things for you. That's not winning, that's honestly not even playing the game, your computer plays the game for you.';

'>>1153535
>Basically at this point I'm pretty much completely out of fun games to play.
wurm online I played for a long time, played with different islands different alliances learned it through and through
started a fresh character because of past then joined the last alliance
in short same thing happened
the alliance got ever more jealous or idk im not white so when they saw I was really good at the game the kicked me out in a particular way
so i went at it alone writing forum posts that helped others huge negativity
so I defended myself, i have been on /pol doing the same learning to write their way AT THE WRONG TIME
and all O get there is bans and all that
look at my namefag you'll see the devestation I have left behind
wurm online takes YEARS to play well like 5 years
and at the end, from me putting people in their place even more deftly than on /pol they just muted me for 24hrs
dude its everywhere people dedicated to ruin everyones fun
theres no escaping it
I was an amateur photographer b4 and I joined a FB group and the same my great pics got hate
instagram I am making great strides no one likes the art
its like the whole world hats progress
but it has imbued me with incredible insights
make them mad but in the safety of anonymity
in that game wurm people have reached a level where they realizing its a fruitless game, the the developer themselves is fucking gaslighting great players
I am SURE this happens all over the place
same with work ffs same with relationships
people go out of their way to damage good people
yeah this is better suited for X because its at that level of freaky deaky';

'>>1183415
I am playing, you’re the one coping.
Get good, get cheats.';

'>>1183420
I got more of an adrenaline rush and have more fun when I use cheats.

The level of control I have over other people and their time is unmatched. When I hack I own you for that time, and their is nothing you can do Except quit playing like a loser.';

'>>1174657
>Do you think this could be solved by the re-emergence of self-hosted servers rather than centralized hosting servers provided by the producers of the games?
This is merely a part of the solution. Back then when it used to be like this the games weren't free to play and this alone discouraged people from cheating because getting banned meant you had to re-buy the game again. This meant that cheating had actual consequences. Nowadays you just need to make a new account in a free2play game and that's it.';

'@1183567
@1183565
Biggest shitter cope I've ever read. Pretty sad.';

'>>1183598
Nice seethe nerd, keep getting owned by me and my cheater friends';

'@1183604
Keep wasting your time and money to show everyone how much of a shitter you are, lol. What can I say. You're the biggest loser I've ever seen in my life.';

'>>1183607
I’m not a loser, I always win. Thanks for being my victim';

'@1183652
No one is your "victim", loser. You're like a retarded kid who smears boogers on his classmates. Everyone is grossed out by your retarded behavior and thinks you're a massive faggot. That's about the extent of it. People pity and ridicule you, because that's the only thing you deserve. And then they move on with their life. You're a laughing stock to every legitimate player that encounters you.

>I always win
No, you don't. You break the rules of the games you cheat in. Like a kid who throws a tantrum over something he can't get and pesters his parents until they get that thing for him. You're a little crybaby. You will never achieve anything in any game out there on your own, and that's why you resort to cheats.';

'>>1183664
Knowing this is how mad the shitters I Kill get makes it even more fun. Saving the screen shots to laugh at later

My favorite thing to do in dayz is to find a group and send all but 1 person back to the coast, then I tie them up and listen to them beg to not get sent back to the coast too, sometimes it goes on for 20 minutes, and I always send ‘em back no matter what.

On the map with the bunker I sit in the bunker and wait for people to come with punch cards and Insta dome them when they come in, lmaoooooo';

'@1183677
So you're like DNSL, except you need cheats to do stuff like that? Pretty sad, not going to lie. If you were good, you could do all this shit without wasting your money on new accounts and shit like that. Go and watch actual good players do it on youtube and maybe you'll learn something.';

'I see no point in cheating. Sounds kinda gay desu';

'>>1183687
What is dsnl

And why do you keep bringing up money? Are you poor or something?

Spending a couple hundred bucks a month is literally nothing for me.

You shouldn’t be playing games if you’re broke';

'Learn to use google/youtube. I know it's hard for you to do things manually, a child of the smartphone generation who's used to "winning" at games with a sweep of his mommy's credit card, but you can at least make an effort once in a while.';

'>>1183944
Like I thought, you’re a brokie.

Wage slave who I own on games and in real life. Get back to work, wagie.';

'@1183956
You will never be good at games. Never forget this, massive loser.';

'>>1183961
I am good. Nothing you do will have an impact, ever. Remember this.';

'Being good takes mechanical skill and a lot of game knowledge. Pressing the "instant win" button doesn't take skill. You will never be good at games. Never forget this, massive loser.';

'>>1153535
>There are also no meaningful progression/goals in these shooters, essentially you just camp around, rack up kills and don't really get anything for it, besides some xp/points that let you unlock cosmetics.
videogames';

'>>1183975
I am good, nothing you say can stop me or make me feel bad, I press the instant win button and am fufilled and enjoy it, the same as any one else playing the game.';

'Sorry man, but you wear the "I suck at games" badge loud and proud. The moment you touched a cheat, you admitted to needing a crutch in order not to get your shit pushed all the way into your head by other players. You will never be good at games. It's a fact. Never forget this.';

'>>1184014
I am good at games and I know this.

I am good and the cheats are okay to use, anyone can use them, you’re dumb not too.

I am good. Ahahahah';

'Literal cope. You will never be good. If you were good, you wouldn't cheat. It's as simple as that.';

'>>1184022
It’s simple, I cheat so I’m good. You seethe that you are too poor to afford cheats, basic';

'Cope more. You will never be good. If you were good, you wouldn't cheat. It's as simple as that.';

'>>1184039
I’m good, seethe more.';

'Nah. You're a shitter with a crutch. Cope more.';

'>>1184051
You’re a crybaby loser who makes excuses when you lose';

'You're a literal cheater, retard. You were never good. The only reason you even get kills is because you cheat. Turn that off and what do you have? Nothing. You're a nobody. A phony.';

'>>1184059
I don’t have to turn it off, nothing ever can stop me from using it. I. Am. good. Get over it , shitter';

'Nah, you aren't. And you never were. And you never will be. Cope more. If you were good, you wouldn't cheat. It's as simple as that. Your cheats may be good. But you personally? You're nothing. A genetic shitter. A failure. A disappointment. Did you really think you could buy the perception of "being good" with cheats? Lmao. I'm sorry, but that's not how it works. The moment you kill another player with cheats, they can tell you cheat, and they can tell you do it because you're bad at games without cheats. Cheating does the exact opposite of what you thought it would do. It puts a huge "I suck at games" sign right on your retarded shitter forehead.';

'>>1184066
Using cheats in DayZ isn't a sign of weakness; it's a testament to skill and creativity. Implementing cheats requires a deep understanding of the game mechanics and adds an extra layer of challenge. It allows for exploration of new strategies and approaches that wouldn't be possible otherwise. While it's important to consider the impact on others, ultimately, it's a personal choice that enhances enjoyment of the game.';

'>>1184066
Oh, how quaint. It seems you've mistaken my strategic brilliance for mere incompetence. Let me enlighten you, dear detractor. Using cheats isn't a crutch for the weak; it's a display of my superior intellect and adaptability. While you cling to the narrow confines of conventional gameplay, I transcend such limitations with my ingenuity. It's not about "buying" perception; it's about asserting my dominance in the virtual realm. You see, my dear critic, your feeble attempts at insults only serve to highlight your own inadequacies. While you wallow in mediocrity, I soar above, leaving you to stew in your envy and bitterness. So, by all means, continue to spew your vitriol. It only reinforces my superiority, and your irrelevance.';

'You can cope and paste as much chatGPT slop as you want, kid. That won't make you magically unsuck at games.';

'You can cope and paste as much chatGPT slop as you want kid. That won't make you magically unsuck at games.';

'You can cope and paste as much chatGPT slop as you want, kid. That won't make you magically unsuck at games.';

'>>1153535
>Have cheaters essentially ruined FPS games for anyone else as well?
>Host a UT99 server for me and me mateys
>Crack open a beer
>Enjoy calling eachother faggots, niggers and noobs each time someone scores a kill or dies
>Wish each other good night before we all go to sleep
>Rinse and repeat for many games both pvp and coop/pve

I don't see a problem.

>But muh LoL, Apex, Overwatch, <insert whatever online matchmaking game made after 2010 here>

Like I said, I don't see a problem.';

'@1184086
You can cope and paste as much chatGPT slop as you want, kid. That won't make you magically unsuck at games.';

'>>1184088
Cope and seethe more you shitter, you can’t beat cheaters, you’re a loser.';

'I don't care how much you paid to make your computer aim your mouse for you. You will always be bad at games.';

'>>1184091
I don’t care how much it costs, i have fun cheating and it makes me good.

Me and my friends have fun shitting on you normies.

Modern multiplayer games are made for people like me, to cheat, and abuse you normal shit tier gamers. Imagine being able to win 100 percent of the time and not doing it? Loser mentality, seethe more.';

'The fact that you cheat will always mean that you suck at games. This will never change. I'm sorry the cheat creator who makes money off of your addiction to making your PC click heads never told you that. NO REFUNDS though.';

'>>1184094
You keep bringing up money, how poor are you? You don’t have an extra 500 a month to waste ? Are you really that broke? Seethe brokecel';

'Once again: I don't care how much you paid to make your computer aim your mouse for you. You will always be bad at games. You can spend $500k on cheats a day, and everyone will still think you're bad.';

'>>1184099
Bruh, this broke-ass loser just can't wrap their head around the fact that being good at DayZ ain't just about grinding for loot or whatever. It's about being smart enough to bend the rules and still come out on top. Like, sorry dude, but if you're too poor to even understand that, maybe you should stick to playing checkers or something. Meanwhile, us big brains will be out here flexing our cheat codes and laughing all the way to the loot stash. Get on our level or stay salty, it's all the same to us.';

'You're too unimaginative to even bait. Christ. How bad can you be at so many things at once?';

'>>1184106
I’m winning, sit kid 1000000000000 - 0';

'You never won in your life once. Participation trophies don't count.';

'I did win';

'Here's your participation trophy, bro: to the cheater loser who never won once and never will.

Thanks for all the (You)'s! I'm now (You)-rich.';

'>>1184116
Ahahahah , buck [broken]. Sit kid';

'cheater bro won sorry normies. Shell out a couple bucks and join or stay coping and seething and losing forever';

'The only thing you can win is a participation trophy, samefag. As always.';

'>>1184125
Still here? I’m winnin.

The more you reply the more I’m right and win harder';

'Winning participation trophies, that's all you're "winning". Ever notice how I never replied to you once? That's because you're a sucker unworthy of even a single (You). Me though? You've been really spoiling me with all the attention and replies. Do go on, I subsist on (You)'s.';

'>>1184166
You’ve been arguing with a language model, and you lost.';

'^ Little does this guy know I use a script to reply, his smoll brain can’t comprehend he has been arguing with a language model this whole time

You’ve been arguing with a language model, and you lost.';

'>>1153535
Cheaters are smart to be honest, they have all the fun at our expense… makes me think…';

'All the bait shit aside, I can't imagine what kind of mouthbreathing tard it takes to actually enjoy cheating. Multiplayer games where I have to actively fight players and survive bore me to tears as it is with how little variety to how firefights play out there is. I can't even imagine cheating AND enjoying the game at the same time. I'd grow bored and shut that shit down after half an hour or less of playing on tutorial mode.';

'The cheater was right, it’s more fun to relax and have fun then try hard and get shit on';

'Nah, he's just a little bitch with skill issues who gets shit on without cheats. 99% of the time fags cheat out of frustration. Good players rarely get shit on, so they have no reason to cheat. A shame someone as bad at games as like him will never understand this.';

'im surprised no one has started posting yaks yet
>>1184087
unlike you Satan, most of us don't have friends that want to play (or even have them at all). Would you be willing to make a deal and give me some friends?';

'I geniunely just don't understand how netcode has gotten so bad in AAA games.
I can so obviously see people shoot me from behind cover and only appear after I'm dead.
Like all netcode has this problem but most mitigate better than others. When this problem is noticeable in Counter-Strike there's an outrage.';

'>>1153535
>youre not getting anything for it, it's so dogwater
No """getting something for it""" is just a fucking bonus, what you're supposed to get out of it, is "fun"
And no cheaters arent ruining FPS, it's the meglomaniacal corpos that have to control every single detail of a fucking match to squeeze every single drop of money out of players they can, allowing hackers to play because banning their accounts means just another purchase when the hacker gets a new account. It's the real reason they stopped """wasting""" resources on allowing private/dedicated servers. To force us all together and maximize bans and "player retention" with match making';

'>>1185374
>no cheaters arent ruining FPS
Stopped reading. You have no idea what you're talking about.';

'Cheating ruins the fun for legit players but for the cheaters it's fun as fuck. And it's only online games, who cares about other players? If you can't handle this and don't want to cheat, quit complaining, all it does is make the cheaters have more fun to see you mad. Source: I cheat at every multiplayer game I play and have immense levels of fun.';

'>>1185854
>you have no idea what youre talking about
>refuses to read a post implying something that he doesnt like
That's your own fault';

'>>1153535
if a game allows LAN then host lan over a vpn (and search up what a vpn actually is, protip, it isnt what shills on jewtube say in their ads)
if a game allows private servers then just get a server, genuinely they are cheap. Whether you have one physically at home or rent server space it isnt particularly expensive or complicated to set up.
If a game doesnt allow either then its a shit game for twats and you shouldnt expect anything decent from it';

'>>1185991
>If a game doesnt allow either then its a shit game for twats and you shouldnt expect anything decent from it
Took me a good 5 years of playing mp games to realize this. But yep. Pretty much. If you can't play with your friends via LAN or if you can't host your own server and actively ban faggots ruining everyone's fun, then it's a shit multiplayer game that's not worth your time.';

'Do any games exist that have good netcode other than like, Counter-Strike?';

'>>1186198
>Counter-Strike
>good netcode
Is this sarcasm?';

'>>1186223
considering the rest of games that aren't valorant or overwatch have worse tick rates and dogshit servers
most likely no';

'>>1186516
Or SBMM.

Between that and the shit tick rates and the mOvEmEnT techniques that allow you to disjoint your hitbox because momentum does not carry at all anymore like it's Quakeworld, it's impossible to enjoy any modern game. I want to get into Battle Royales like my friends like but I cannot because they all play like hot dogshit.';

'>>1186637
I've had some fun in Apex Legends shortly after it was released but it was insane how quickly I've lost interest, it just happened overnight. With every other game I've had a period in which I was like "I don't think this is fun anymore, I should probably uninstall this" but with Apex I've simply stopped playing one day and haven't touched it since.';

'>>1155116
Kys faggot. You ruined gaming and will never be a real woman';

'>>1185939
Kys, faggot. You've ruined gaming because you weren't any good/never had a father. I bet your trans , too. Bet you wear fake glasses and have fake clout and wished u could suck that little faggot symfunny's dick.';

'>>1185374
Kys, faggot. You'll never be a real person.';

'>spams the thread
>has nothing of substance to say
>gets no replies
/vm/ based';

'>>1183565
Esoterik lost.';

'>kys, faggot';

'>>1169793
it's not subhumans, it's the fucking lack of moderation and the new culture unaccustomed to having people tell them to fuck off.

CUSTOMER's always right, one-size-fits-all, consolization.';

'Cheating is part of gaming, quit crying';

'Cheaters? No, I rarely run into them. What makes games unfun is SBMM.';

'>>1189442
That's true too. Casual shooters died when faggot devs became obsessed with muh fAiR mAtChMaKiNg, which in reality just turns every single match into an MGL sweatlord competition and makes people tryhard their ass off to maintain a k/d of 1. When you have SBMM shoved down everyone's throat in every single shooter's "CASUAL" mode like it's ranked, you know the genre is fucking dead.';

'>>1189944
Funny thing is casual/ranked already felt the same in a lot of games, but then I played the finals and found out that their ranked doesn't even match you with people in the same bracket, it's still sbmm in the background.

I imagine team fortress 2 would have a hundredth of it's playerbase today if servers were stuck in 6v6 and people would only play half the classes, because obviously competitive is the point of playing games.';

'>>1189998
Man, TF2 public servers were great. Except Valve fucked up by adding matchmaking and quick map rotation, ruining the comfy feel. Now only a few community servers keep the old style settings, since Valve reconfigured their own to be matchmade.
And of course bots were ruining everything. Every second game you had a spinning sniper headshotting everything.';

'>>1189944
Literally a skill issue.
Get better.';

'>>1191070
The better you get, the sweater your lobbies become, and the higher likelihood of running into cheaters. Are you braindead? No one "wins" with SBMM, brainlet. You can only bury yourself deeper with it, not get away from it or "overcome" it somehow. Faggot. Massive braindead fucking faggot. Kill yourself.';

'>>1191097
Shitty gamer perspective';

'>>1154812
Insurgency Sandstorm has a good amount of cheaters in official servers';

'>>1153535
i dont see much cheaters, i play cs2 premier around 10 matches every week ive 18k rating, ive seen maybe 1-2 cheaters in the last 4 months, i play on EU, its not as common as people claim imo, ive seen lots of cheaters in EFT but still not as much as other people do, when i play cs ive been called cheater many times when i have a good day and it makes me think that people often exaggerate the number of cheaters';

'>>1193423
CS is one of the few games where I'd say the cheater problem is under control.';

'>>1191070
skill yourself';

'>>1193425
This is what silvers unironically believe.';

'>>1194042
there's plenty of cheaters in silver as well, no idea what these retards are talking about';

'>>1194066
Maybe they live in some shithole like South Africa where people are more concerned with buying food than paying for hacks.';

'>>1194066
he's being retarded on purpose, even cheat devs admit that hacking in CS is ridiculous https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k6v0B8ZSyNs';

'>>1189442
The reason you don't run into many cheaters is the SBMM lil retard';

'>>1196150
About the only good thing about SBMM, because all the cheaters are put in containment sweatlord ranks... unless you're good, in which case fuck you, get cheated and sweated on, scrub. "Competitive" games are so fucking dead, man. There's no integrity at higher levels of play left in "competitive" multiplayer shooters, not an ounce.

Which actually reminds me of the fact that most "pro-players" in competitive games aren't superhuman, they're just above average. They're good players, they're pretty good, but they're nowhere near some of the fuckery you'll encounter in higher ranks in most of these games. What I realized a while back is that integrity and sportsmanship matter a lot more in e-sports than being some god-tier human aimbot. Back when Ubisoft first announced that they were planning to host professional e-sports tournaments in R6S, anyone could sign up to be a "pro player". Any retard could try and become a "pro", and sign up with some team, or create his own team. And many did just that in fact.';

'>>1196250
>because all the cheaters are put in containment sweatlord ranks
but this isn't even true, every rank in CS has plenty of cheaters
no doubt it gets exponentially worse as you rise in ranks, but low ranks still have more than plenty

i think the only competitive/SBMM kind of FPS game i've played I haven't ran into any cheaters was hunt showdown, apparently there's a lot in six stars but i've only ever been five stars';

'>>1196250
most cheaters are absolute dogshit and would go 0 - 15 without cheats. with cheats they just about manage a positive kd since they know where everyone is and use aim assist';

'>Which actually reminds me of the fact that most "pro-players" in competitive games aren't superhuman, they're just above average.

This goes for pretty much all competitive endeavors. There's usually a few once-in-a-lifetime talents, and the rest of the guys are just above average, just more consistent about being above average.

When you see a player do something that seems impossible, the only 3 reasonable assumptions are A) he's cheating, B) he got lucky or C) the game's netcode fucked up.

The people who live in the clouds of "yes I was walking silently but he's a Global Elite so of course he knew exactly when to throw a smoke grenade because people at this level are just so good :)" are delusional.';

'>>1197543
Isn't everyone cheating at high level common knowledge? Both video game and sports.';

'>>1198816
Are you 5-6 stars? I think I've only encountered that sort of blatant fuckery once or twice (and it was in 5 star lobbies). Usually I try to derank and sit at comfy 3-4 stars, because that's where all the legit players (shitters) are, and that's why I practically never run into cheaters, apart from those who are brand new and on their way to 5-6 stars.';

'I'm honestly surprised the insanely low tick rates don't piss more gamers off, since in essence it means that no matter how much money you spent to run Fortnite at 240 frames per second, by default you're actually running it at 8 frames per second.';

'>>1153535
Cheaters have ALWAYS been a major problem in FPS games.
The issue is exacerbated now tho because:
1: the reliance on always-online progression systems and company sided matchmaking means there are no admins to control and ban the cheaters. They rely entirely on 3rd party programs and player reports, which aren't worth a damn at all.
>let me note too, modern games with player servers run a far cleaner game experience when the admins are active and ban cheaters.
2: The rise of esports and streaming has made cheating in an fps a lucrative option. The potential for fame, ego, money, etc; its all extremely tempting and the community is full of blind retards who will defend cheaters and claim it isnt an issue/problem.
>"i HaVe nEveR SeEn a cHEaTer tHo"
3: cheating begets cheating. The more poeple cheat, the more legit players fall to temptation and cheat.
I am guilty of sampling cheats in the past. Ive paid for a few 24 hour trials on some of my fave games with an alt account just to test that I wasnt crazy, that the cheats werent getting banned, etc.
Blew my mind how so few knew, how none of the accounts were ever banned and how easy it was to tell as a cheater how many other players were also cheating.
But some players stay cheating, unlike me where I just said I'm too fucking old to care and gave up on the genre.';

'>>1175764
He is talking about detecting inhuman movements serverside, as data from each computer is being managed.
Anti-cheat developers generally do not try to detect crazy movements/actions.
Anti-cheat developers ADMIT all the time that they ONLY try to detect the software used to cheat.
They do not at all try to control for player actions in the match, they leave that to the devs.
This isnt common knowledge, but it isnt a secret either.
This is why anti-cheat software is so utterly useless. They dont want liability for false bans and they cant parse the server side data.
This is why their realm of expertise is so extremely narrow and focused entirely around detecting illegal software, period.

It's super easy to track and ban for consistently odd/illegal moves server side, most devs just choose to not bother with it.';

'>>1165553
>And for people coming over from consoles, it's easy to take a playable multiplayer environment for granted.
consoles are not free of cheaters, it's just in different forms.';

'>>1153535
>FPS
>fun games
Kekking right now.';

'>>1199272
>inhuman movements
Such as? You mean like snapping your aim to somebody's head? It's trivial for the aimbot to add a little noise to the movement, making it very hard to distinguish from real skill. And any such detection is by necessity game-specific, since you need to determine legal moves that are nonetheless impossible to achieve. Not reliable.
>It's super easy to track and ban for consistently odd/illegal moves server side, most devs just choose to not bother with it.
Completely inaccurate. Discarding incorrect inputs server-side is netcode 101. The reason anti-cheat developers don't bother with it is because every marginally competent server implementation is already doing it as a matter of course. All high-level hacks work client-side and send technically legal input.';

'>>1153535
It's slowly ruining TF2 for me. I just want to ignore the bot problem for a moment - even in non bot infested games there's usually at least one closeted cheater on one team. Happens more often than not and it is a bit demoralizing to keep playing against these people.';

'>>1199352
Rather quickly we went from "it's trivial to do but devs are lazy" to "train and integrate an AI council to heuristically determine if somebody's cheating". AI is not magic. It is certainly neither easy nor cheap, and will still make mistakes.
And the first time you automatically ban a legitimate player for being too good, well, you better hope the gaming community feels merciful that day. "We have determined you are not shit enough to play our game" is not a good message to send.';

'>>1199352
>Its literally being done when youre filled out captchas or playing runescape.
Oh and also, captchas are hilariously ineffective these days. And that's not even going into how the "point out motorcycles" captchas are actually you training the machines.';

'>>1199344
>Playing an FTP shooter and expecting it not to be filled with cheaters
Lol.';

'>>1199402
>They dont even want to hire people for free to work as interns and I dunno rent them a flat or something or pay them min wage to work on it. Why do that
Because it either doesn't work, or would cost way, way much more than you imagine. Your solution would be untenable due to problems in like three different domains. I'm honestly beginning to think you're either not thinking this through or are arguing in bad faith.';

'>>1199417
He's just retarded.

Like I said the best way to kill cheaters to begin with is to strip the third-world brown hordes of white man's technology. After that we go back to server-based games where admins can ban cheaters efficiently. We also need an education campaign to finally shut up the retards for good who think "oh but all the pros constantly do 180 flickshots and know where everyone is at all times, that's just called being good!"

Granted a lot of people like that are probably cheaters themselves. Just like how if you point out a profession is mostly scammers, like mechanics, you always get one guy who's like "uh no I'm the only real mechanic the rest of those guys are just part throwers," and you can tell immediately that he's a scammer.';

'>>1199342
you're just wrong. I ran a cs source server years ago. there were plug ins from the community you could add to auto boot and ban for illegal actions.
"legit" hacks arent what I am talking about, as in, hacks that stay strictly within legal actions/movements.
But, you can still detect for some of these "legal" actions tho.
I sometimes enable the turbo clicker for my razer mouse thru synapse in some games (long story short, i have some issues from a HS baseball injury in my right hand). NEVER had an issue with using it in multiplayer games, but The Finals will kick me when I use it for "illegal program actions".
They dont ban, just kick. Thats fair imo.
Point is, server side they can absolutely detect a good amount of that stuff, especially given the most common form of cheating is anything from my turbo clicker to AHK no-recoil scripts to actual functional AHK triggerbots.
But they don't ban for that and they don't kick for that. and the cheat devs wont ban for it because there are too many chances for false positives.

>>1199263
>>1199272
Adding to my previous post, an example of a cheat dev stating exactly what they develop for:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vui-YBPvaKM

Similarly interesting:
a pretty good vid of a hacker/hack creator giving a tell-all:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RwzIq04vd0M';

'>>1199396
>>1199417
I hope you realize youre not arguing with me there.

this is me
>>1199263
>>1199272
not me:
>>1199352
>>1199402';

'>>1199593
>Reddit and overwatch have proven that left in charge to self-regulate, faggots ruin everything and kick everyone off who doesnt comply to their circle jerk. Gone are the eras of cool people who do cool things. Everyone is a socially retarded sociopathic faggot now.
So run one yourself.
I ran a conan exiles server for a year after getting tired of all the faggots and their gay rules and bans.
My only rules were no undermeshing and no spamming builds/landclaim.
I didnt ban for anything else.
I reset the server 4 times.
Beyond that everyone knew i was the admin and also played.

It isn't hard. Either pay a few hundred and ask for donations to a paypal or whatever, or run it from your basement if its a smaller game like CS.
We just literally don't have the option to do so.
Also, its all centralization, reddit, discord are both central and dont require even a small amount of computer intelligence.
In the past it was all independent systems, IRC and Mumble/Teamspeak servers.

Many coders are trannys, but not all trannys are coders, so its exascerbated given how easy it is to run a subreddit ro discord server as opposed to running an actual website yourself and running an irc channel.
>still not hard, but not as accessible for morons as reddit and discord are

Regardless, not arguing any specific point, just talking.';

'>>1200196
>But they don't ban for that and they don't kick for that. and the cheat devs wont ban for it because there are too many chances for false positives.
You've answered yourself, here. They don't use it automatically because there would be an unacceptable amount of false positives. Server-side is the same.
The AHK kicks you've described are exactly the game-specific, tailor-made detectors I was talking about. They take time and patience to develop, and you need to be very careful to avoid false positives. The false positives are the reason they're not bans, and why they can't be used at scale, on every server. It's just some nerd's "good enough for me" anti-cheat implementation. Commendable, yes, but not global-grade.
The mouse clicker I would guess is normally allowed for exactly your use case, but disabled in tournaments because tournaments are specifically for hyper-competitive players. In that specific setting only, they want to disallow cheaters more than they want to cater to special needs. But general-purpose servers cannot afford to be so opinionated.';

'FPS multiplayer is basically dead to be honest. Statistically there will be at least one cheater in every match at this point.

If you are playing ranked it's HVH or fighting paid boosters

Kids today would rather pay for a cheat subscription or some b-tier pro to carry them';

'I remember having this discussion in the past and the only solution we came up with is games becoming a streaming service. Something like Google Stadia where the game is run on the company's rigs and servers and you only get to interact with the screen. That way you can't cheat because you have no access to any information.

>>1170073
CS2 isn't as crisp as CSGO. There's a certain floatiness to your actions especially noticeable when shooting/aiming. This was actually acknowledged by the dev team. But it's still not perfect. The subtick technology is a downgrade.

Also I'm pretty sure a lot of people are cheating. Unranked niggas playing and aiming better than pros lmao. I've entered a match where some guy instakilled the enemy team with grenades somehow from the starting area.

>>1176770
Games should be 60 tick at a minimum. BRs are usually 20 tick

>>1184214
A previous anon already got their personality down. They're generally losers trying to emulate their favorite streamer but they're too low skill. They use cheats to cope that they're good at something. They even believe cheats are normal to cope further.

They're like trannies. Constantly trying to trick people into thinking they're legit good players. Afraid someone will expose and deadname them lol.';

'>>1189944
The thing with SBMM (or EOMM now) is that if you are an above average player the system is just designed to shit on you. Since it has to drag you down to 1.0 it sends the sweatiest high ranks in your match or teams you up with deadweight. You just constantly feel like an unpaid booster.

>>1198816
It's so obvious in CS lol. They absolutely never check any corner except yours.';

'>>1200671
>The thing with SBMM (or EOMM now) is that if you are an above average player the system is just designed to shit on you. Since it has to drag you down to 1.0 it sends the sweatiest high ranks in your match or teams you up with deadweight. You just constantly feel like an unpaid booster.
That's basically how matchmaking works in Siege. I remember struggling hard to get out of bronze, felt like carrying every ranked match and losing most of them because my teammates couldn't get one fucking kill. Then I started throwing games on purpose and guess what? The game started matching me with good teammates who carried me to plat. This was when the ranked system was still in "beta", but I doubt much has changed since then in that regard.';

'>>1200666
>That way you can't cheat because you have no access to any information.
Yeah... About that: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lbs0Ld5Wff0';

'>>1200677
This is blatantly cheating. MSI went full retard there, and has proven they don't have a single gamer in their entire chain of management. I wish I was surprised.
Anyway, it seems they have since backpedaled, because I can't find a single mention of this Skysight feature on their site.';

'>>1200666
clussy';

'>>1200851
I'd go as far as to say they'd fall 60%+ because of one single country. Most cheats are made in China, and then distributed outside of it. It's a multi-billion dollar industry over there. Unsurprisingly, the Chinese also represent a huge percentage of cheaters in any give game.';

'>>1201040
Right but my point being that only whites have an honor culture. When the internet was mostly autistic white guys cheating was not as rampant of an issue.';

'>>1200542
I think we are talking past one another fren.

My point is that despite having the capability to ban/kick for the most basic and most easily controlled things on server side, the vast majority of companies DO NOT ban for those.
You're right, yes, one tier higher which adds in false noise to the actions would be more difficult to detect.
But my point is that the devs aren't even banning for the easily detectable shit, the stuff that is obvious and doesn't add noise.

And as for the cheat devs, you're also misunderstanding me.
The anti-cheat devs do not have access to server side info because thats not what they develop for. they can only see whats running on a persons pc, so they can see AHK and synapse and ghub running, but they wont ban for it because there are legit uses for those programs and they specifically will not ban for actions.
Watch that video i linked with the interview of the anti-cheat dev, he explains they ALL only try to detect illegal software, and thats it.
They even ask about server side stuff and he says they leave that to the game devs.
Its crazy how little anti cheats actually do after watching the vidd.
90% of it is game dev sided.

So again, my point is, the game devs 'could' ban for illegal actions, even just basic shit (ignoring false noise added to actions to obfuscate), just default, low effort turbo clickers and other shit.
My point is the vast majority dont kick or ban for even this stuff.
The finals was literally the first game ive played that kicked for my turbo clicker (i mean good on them).
Like most no-recoil scripts are just a couple lines of code repeated, a server sided detector should e ale to detect that and kick.

So my point is only that yes obfuscations is another layer to detection, but they could easily detect and kick for automated shit... but most dont.';

'>>1170073
>I have 1600 hours in CSGO and I was consistently the top of the leaderboard for every match then when CS2 came out I started getting beaten by noobs
I had 1600-ish hours in CS 1.6
I tried CSGO when it first came out (even have the token showing i paid for it before it went free to play) and I was absolute ass at CSGO.
Just like you, my experience was just getting wrecked by scrubs and noobs who didnt even know the map.
I would re-try CSGO maybe once a year, it'd fucking suck and I'd think I was crazy, so I'd download old CS1.6 and test myself, and it always felt like butter.

CS2 comes out, and it feels like CS1.6, like fucking butter, its amazing. I love the game again.
But my brother and his friend who never played 1,6 think CS2 is garbage and they cant hit the broad side of a barn.

I have no fucking clue what Volvo did between CS1.6/S > CSGO > CS2, but for me CSGO was unplayable, and for the CSGO gen, CS2 is unplayable.';

'>>1174657
>Do you think this could be solved by the re-emergence of self-hosted servers rather than centralized hosting servers provided by the producers of the games?
It is an obvious solution yes.
Its not the ideal solution and it's not perfect, but it is one way to at least dampen the insane amount of cheating.
As the other anon said, HLL, etc have community servers, they're not perfect, but they're leagues better than the shit you see going on in matchmaking based FPS games.

I think a middle ground would be:
Dev sided matchmaking for Ranked ladders.
Community server browser for anything else.

The devs can focus on balance and standardizing the gameplay in their ranked formats, while the community can police itself and generate "emergent content" in the public servers.';

'>>1175135
>That point is well made, and I think it illustrates part of why the self-hosted ecosystems have been discarded over time.
I disagree with this both in conclusion and reason.

Self hosted servers werent killed off in AAA gaming because communities were insular and closed off to new players.
They were killed off because public servers couldnt be easily controlled at the time and it was another vector in which online piracy could allow people to play without paying.

Yes some servers were run by faggots, but it really was not an issue back then.
The real reason was them trying to control piracy and to control the player experience.
COD:MW2 was the first ever FPS game on PC to release without community hosted servers.
Consider that before assuming it was another reason.
Tangential evidence that I'm right is that at the same time they began killing off LAN functionality in games because of the rise of stuff like Hamachi and Garena.

Seriously, just talking here, but you're wrong if you think it was killed off for any reason other than corporate suits fearing piracy

The advantage they have today tho is that with an abundance of server hosting companies, they can bring back the public servers and just not release the server hosting code.
At the time they had to release that code, now they dont (i dont like that solution myself, but its still a solution).
HLL for instance controls the level of modding and controls which companies can host.
Not ideal, but it does solve the issue of cheaters without upsetting the piracy-phobes';

'>>1201040
>Unsurprisingly, the Chinese also represent a huge percentage of cheaters in any give game.
Unironically, get on at 2AM and play a multiplayer game of any amount of popularity.
You will see names made of chink characters, and they will be cheating blatantly.
IT.IS.INSANE.THEY.DO.NOT.REGION.LOCK.
and if they dont want to region lock, at least fucking PING KICK.
Ping too high? kick. that's all.
And if you get some stupid nigger on a wifi connection they're stealing from their neighbor kicked for too high of ping/too much noise, who really loses out?';

'>>1200666
I cheat and have fun, get fucked.';

'>>1200646
>Statistically there will be at least one cheater in every match at this point.
This is sadly likely accurate.
Consider the following:
10% of players cheat.

Is this unbelievable or out of the question?
Is it not possible that 10% of players cheat in online competitive games?
If we agree that 10% isnt an unreasonable estimate as to the number of players cheating in online gaming, then that means, 1 in 10 players you come across are cheating.
Which means for every 5 vs 5 game you play, you're running into 1 cheater per match.

If the majority of players accepted and realized this, it would probably kill multiplayer gaming.
>reminds me of Henry Ford's quote:
>"It is well enough that people of the nation do not understand our banking and monetary system, for if they did, I believe there would be a revolution before tomorrow morning."
The one thing about humans I respect is that when people can't cope/deny anymore and have to accept reality, they tend to be brutal in their reaction.';

'>>1201435
>I cheat and have fun, get fucked.
at least you admit it.';

'>>1201436
there's a site you can or used to be able to use to link your account and look at all past matches, i remember seeing some fairly high rank account's match history and there was a couple cheaters here and there as you go through the matches, then at a certain point literally every single match that guy played had a player who was eventually VAC'd

wish i saved it, it's pretty much what gave me the same view as you';

'>>1201743
this was for CSGO obviously';

'>>1201436
>then that means, 1 in 10 players you come across are cheating.
no it doesn't, trust factor funnels cheaters together making the silent majority of games cheater free. Though the population of specific regions you start running into problems';

'>>1202373
>he believes marketing buzzwords

I have prime enabled and still seen cheaters';

'FPS are super boring so the only enjoyment in them is dicking around with blatant cheats making people mad.';

'>>1201436
statistically that's bullshit
20-30 percent at least cheat and that's a extremely conservative estimate it's probably more like somewhere in 40 percent';

'>>1202373
Lol if you believe that.
SBMM puts players who are capable of having positive K/Ds together, meaning both players that are above-average and cheaters. This ruins the experience for decent players but since the grand majority of people who play a game are subhumans who can't even raise themselves out of the lowest ranks most companies don't care.';

'The absolute state of Escape From Cheatkov. Like, how do things get bad so bad, 90% of discussion about a game at any given time is about fucking cheaters? Is the entire game made up of cheaters at this point or what?';

'>>1202595
it was over as soon as the wiggle video was made and they made a few bluff posts and went back to not doing shit about it.';

'>>1202387
>statistically that's bullshit
Its not meant to be a statistic, its called a rhetorical argument.
I am not making a statistical declaration, I am simply asking the average anon here is 10% is a ridiculous number of assumed cheaters.
If it isn't out of the question for a random anon then even a low 10% is 1 in 10, which is minimum 1 per match.
This is how you reach the people outside of here who insist there are no cheaters.
It doesn't take graphs and facts and such, most people blank out at that.
But a probing question like "is 10% too high a guess?" is an opening to convince them and if they deny it, they'll look ridiculous to most lurkers watching the discussion.

So yeah, I'm with you, I think its way more than 10%. But for the sake of argument, for a rhetorical point, 10% is still damning if they accept that premise.

>>1202373
No it doesn't. Read everything else being said here, watch the two videos I linked.
The interview of an anti cheat dev shows the anti cheat deva do not program for detecting illegal actions, they detect for illegal programs/tasks in the PC.
The second video shows how theyre using a small rasberry pi to run the cheats to avoid the anti cheat programs now.
The problem is not that they can't catch it. The problem is that the AAA devs don't care at all to police players besides basic checks and they refuse to give some of the power back to the players by providing a robust player hosting environment along side their matchmaking systems';

'>>1202645
Yep. I left.
Isn't Hunt full of cheaters too tho?
I'd love to try it but cheating in certain subgenres are far less acceptable than in others.
I can handle quick matches of CSGO or whatever else. The suffering is short and worst case I can leave a non-ranked match a couple cheaters there I lose nothing but a little time.
Extraction shooters however are potentially weeks of time spent, even months can be stolen from you in such an unbalanced and frustrating way.
An exceptionally bad loss will haunt you for days.
Even battle royales are harder to stomach cheating in for me given how long some matches can be. You fight your way to the end and then just die to a bullshit cheater, it makes it all feel so pointless.';

'>>1202791
>Isn't Hunt full of cheaters too tho?
When a new event starts (and they take place back to back), the game turns into an unplayable mess. Every lobby from 3 to 5 stars and up has at least one cheater, often multiple. Once the hype dies down a bit/cheaters grind out the battlepass (which can take 2-3 weeks) you stop running into as many cheaters. At the end of the last event I stopped running into cheaters completely and I was playing in 5 star lobbies too. This event that started like a couple days ago though? Kind of boring, and the battlepass sucks too, so I decided to just take a break from the game completely for like a month so I can avoid all the sweats and cheating faggots.';

'>>1202783
>But a probing question like "is 10% too high a guess?" is an opening to convince them
Honestly this feels more like a leading question. I believe your intentions are genuine, but asking if 10% is believable is basically setting a trap, taking advantage of the fact that statistics are notoriously difficult to intuit. 10% sounds like a small number, so you can probably convince someone to agree. But realistically, a 10% cheater rate is a ridiculously high number. A real life event with such a ratio would collapse, because you would see cheating everywhere.
If somebody agrees that 10% is realistic in today's climate, and truly knows what it means, then he already has a grim outlook and needs no convincing. But that's only if he understands that this is way above an "honest community" baseline, which I would say is less than 1%.';

'>>1153535
They ruin all the fun. Same with meta gamers.';

'>>1202386
They're not boring, but everything is geared toward sweaty esports cqb action. People don't have the attention spans for other types of play anymore. It's a shame.';

'>>1202968
>But realistically, a 10% cheater rate is a ridiculously high number
How can you say that with a straight face?
10% is absolutely not unreasonable and that's exactly why, as you've even suggested, people would "intuit" that its accurate.
You are so absolutely ignorant on this subject if you genuinely think 10% is too high.

"The Wiggle That Killed Tarkov" video blew the lid off the cheating epidemic there. He estimated 60% of people in a lobby were cheating.
Recently War Thunder banned over 40,000 players in one ban wave.
I've personally tested a simple wall hack on an alt account for CSGO in unranked using a similar technique as the wiggle video:
I would crouch spam at someone thru walls until they did it back at me.
The cheat shows their skeleton frame and the direction they're facing.
In unranked, 2-3 players per match would crouch spam back at me..
Game devs (especially young/independent) will very often acknowledge large cheater issues after launch or during a beta, only to go radio silent on the issue a little later

Now, that's all actual blatant full on CHEATING. Aim bots, wallnhacks, etc.
That's vast amounts of blatant and confirmed cheating with illegal and permanent bannable software.
So this all doesn't even touch the surface of less egregious cheats. The "legit" cheats like simple no-recoil scripts or simple triggerbots written in auto hot key, or programs that spoof controllers to give aim assist to mouse and KB players.
The finals FPS game was overrun with one of those spoofer programs very recently. It was blatant and overwhelming. Players admitted it saying it wasn't even cheating, and its a $30 program, so people were paying for this advantage.

You need to do more research, you're genuinely ignorant here.

cheat dev stating what they develop for:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vui-YBPvaKM

a pretty good vid of a hacker/hack creator giving a tell-all:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RwzIq04vd0M';

'>>1201414
I think we have a disagreement over what constitutes an "easy" server-side anti-cheat measure.
Obviously an anti-cheat won't work server-side. I wouldn't expect it to. Like you said, it's up to the devs. It's a perfectly natural state of things for me.

I maintain that it is not easy to detect "basic" cases server-side. The initial argument was that it's trivial. I'm not saying it's impossible, just that it takes noticeable time and effort, you can't just copy-paste it into a new project.

You've mentioned a plugin. Is that it? https://github.com/J-Tanzanite/Little-Anti-Cheat
All the described detectors are a result of the community working them out over a period of time. You can expect a big company to invest such resources, but again: time and effort.

I also think that the reason these plugins work is that they have lower standards than what a built-in solution needs. That FAQ is rife with notes about false positives. You simply cannot have that when scaling to millions of players, many with unique valid edge cases.

There's also how the packages sent to the server are optimized for size, and thus cut to the absolute minimum. You might do a wild swerve with your mouse, but what the server gets is likely a streamlined fraction of that information. This too makes it harder to distinguish artificial from genuine input.

Consider also the basilisk effect. An anti-cheat installed as a server plugin will be found only on a small percentage of servers. Thus the cheaters migrate to unprotected servers instead of modifying their hacks. But if the same anti-cheat were to be used globally, then the cheats are forced to adapt, and soon you get a tweaked version that eludes detection. The devs have expended effort, but the status quo remains the same.

Finally, I'm sorry, I'm sure the vids are interesting, but I have a strong allergy to non-written content that I cannot read quickly. But nothing that you've mentioned about them was surprising to me so far.';

'>>1202996
>10% is absolutely not unreasonable and that's exactly why, as you've even suggested, people would "intuit" that its accurate.
>You are so absolutely ignorant on this subject if you genuinely think 10% is too high.
Unreasonable in the sense that even with just a 10% cheater rate, the game is already unplayable. Not in the sense that I do not believe it.
10% is too high for a fair competition to take place. Observing a 30% cheater rate does not disprove my statement.
I do not appreciate being called ignorant.';

'>>1202805
>grinding out the battlepass

Honestly this is probably part of the problem as well. With all the time-limited shit in these games these days, there's more incentive to cheat. It's not the old days where I could just hop on MW2 and know that eventually if I play the game enough I'm going to own everything in the game that I paid $60 for.';

'>>1203028
Okay, I'm going to go point by point to be fair.
>Unreasonable in the sense that even with just a 10% cheater rate, the game is already unplayable.
People will play a lot of garbage and they will cope and lie to themselves.

>Not in the sense that I do not believe it.
This wasn't clear in my first read and it is still difficult for me to see that in how you wrote it (and this second read thru is me assuming in good faith you agree 10% isnt out of the question)
>10% is too high for a fair competition to take place. >Observing a 30% cheater rate does not disprove my statement.
I agree that the competition is pointless in such an environment. We agree on that.
But the reality is that most people will cope and have faith it's all legit. Some of the smartest guys I know in computing cannot believe me.
Thats why I cheated on an alt in CSGO, because I was sincerely concerned I was gaslighting myself due to how few people in the community and how few friends agreed with me that it was filled with cheaters.
Lance Armstrong, Barry Bonds, etc, everyone believed them, until they didnt.
We are in the state of gaming right now of willful ignorance by the community at large.
>I do not appreciate being called ignorant.
Listen, it wasn't meant as an insult, it was meant as a genuine observation given how much experience and research I've done.
If someone doubts 10% in gaming in general, they're uninformed.
And if someone who doubts it, argues about it, that's ignorance.
If I misread your points and intentions, then I do apologize, but if you actually think 10% is not realistic then that opinion comes from a place of ignorance.

That's all I'm saying

Regardless. Everything I'm saying, including my rhetorical question about 10% is all designed to help people to realize how bad it all is.
You can call that "leading" all you like, but that is how minds are changed.
NOTHING will change without convincing the masses';

'>>1203038
>not that anon but honestly I think 10% is hilariously low.
>id say 30% is more likely.
Oh I agree, but 10% is a kind of "compromise" when engaging with a gamer who doesnt believe cheating is a thing at all.
Starting at such a hilariously low amount like 10% is a rhetorical strategy.
When we discuss this stuff (or politics, or culture or whatever) you need to focus on changing minds, not being "right".
When people side with you they open their minds to consider your points.
Thats why you bring them in with 10%.
They agree? its easy going forward, youll convince them quickly.
They disagree? youre not starting at a premise of 30% or higher, youre starting at a simple and easy 10%. Its a much easier position to argue from.

>>1203018
>I maintain that it is not easy to detect "basic" cases server-side. The initial argument was that it's trivial. I'm not saying it's impossible, just that it takes noticeable time and effort, you can't just copy-paste it into a new project.
Okay, then I understand what you're saying.
I disagree, from personal experience and in seeing the game The Finals do it.
Steam forums are full of people crying about being kicked for random error codes.
All those error codes relate to specific detected automation scripts/tasks.
So these players arent CHEATING, but they're cheating by abusing scripts, macros and automation.
If the Finals can do it, I don't think its as difficult as you think.
But regardless, yes we disagree on an "easy" server sided cheat.

Seriousy dude, watch that interview with a cheat dev i linked if you havent already.
The discussion is very interesting.';

'>>1203028
Not everyone is a blatant spinbot. Not all cheaters are griefers most of them just want an unseen unfair advantage. They are hacking but you are lead to believe it could be legit because they only use soft aimbots, esp, radar etc. These have plausible deniability because you can be mislead to believe it's luck, gamesense or whatever.';

'>>1203283
>most of them just want an unseen unfair advantage.
Its wild how many streamers are caught cheating monthly. Big or small, doesn't matter.
Setting yourself up for streaming takes effort and time and money.
Then they cheat.

It seems fairly obvious that they're only catching the biggest idiots too.
They get caught because they flash a third monitor by accident or show their wall hacks.
But even that stuff is more obvious than some of the most insidious stuff, like trigger bots and aim stickiness thru walls.
Don't need wall hacks if you can 'feel' sticky aim thru a wall,
And they're insidious because they're easy to hide, easy to justify and easy to deny.';

'>>1153535
It's actually been kind of a blessing in disguise for me. All the massive cheating in every popular shooter these days has caused me to start getting really into RTS games and I'm a lot happier for it. Having lots of fun playing Supreme Commander right now.';

'Yknow what's funny, even if I could hire my own cheat dev, it wouldn't make the games that fun. You'd simply have some games where you stomp, and then you'd just end up in the pro/hacker bracket where your winrate would level out. The game basically plays the same no matter how good or bad you are. No wonder I'm getting so bored of them.';

'>>1205020
You don't think like a cheater. They don't play the game for the experience or gameplay.

They just want to make number go up at your expense and delude themselves that the shiny badge they got was because they're good at something';

'>>1205020
Cheaters do it for the ego or malice';

'>>1202601
>they made a few bluff posts and went back to not doing shit about it
Why would they? Cheaters literally fund the development of the game. They do "ban waves" every few months, because if they start banning cheaters daily it'll scare them off and they'll stop re-buying accounts. Every few months, when BSG needs a new cash infusion, they'll ban a few thousand cheater accounts and just rack in the cash when most of them buy new accounts. Cheats cost a lot more per month than these fucking accounts that will last cheaters at least a few months lmao. Obvious rage hackers can cheat for weeks, something a month+ before anything is done about them. You can have a kd of thousands, and they still won't do shit about you, at least for a while.';

'>>1205223
The most appalling part to me is that they'll first put the game on sale, then instantly ban a bunch of cheaters, so they're more willing to spend money on new accounts. It's their business model.';

'>>1205027
>>1205141
this';

'ultymately cheaters exist because we are in the downfall of civilization and man has no problem cheating his fellow man. no amont of anticheat will help a problem that is purely social in nature.';

'>>1153535
CSGOkys definitely ruined. I mostly play arma 3 and only see hackers on rare occasions.';

'>>1205798
There were cheaters in antiquity. There were always cheaters, and there will always be cheaters, until the heat death of the universe.';

'drdisrespect cheated on his wife you dont think he cheats in FPS games as well?? one is his closest companion someone you are meant to give everything too and the others are just random strangers on the internet.';

'>>1205817
>drdisrespect cheated on his wife
Damn, that's shitty. I liked the guy, but now I'll just think poorly of him. What a shame. I wouldn't say he cheats in games though, he seems like just about an above average cod sweatlord. I play just like him, if not better, and I know I don't cheat. He dies and rages quite often too.';

'>>1168095
Looks like that is just the last 30 days or something like that.';

'Can we talk about cheats instead of pol retardation? Thanks!';

'^ I'm not reading this wall of autism';

'Let's stick to discussing cheats.

Anyone here play Hunt? Has there been an uptick in gaming chairs since the start of the new event?';

'>>1207059
Japs aren't white either and they don't cheat. No one ever complains about "fucking cheating Japs", it's always Chinks. Always. 70-80% of cheaters are Chinks, because their commie man-eat-man culture of walking on each other's heads to get ahead in life promotes this type of behavior. To an extent this is true for people in former soviet countries as well. A lot of cheaters are from places like Russia too.';

'All this fucking intrustive Riot Vanguard bullshit and it doesn't even stop wallhacks.';

'>>1207743
>wallhacks
Probably just radar. They can't really stop radar cheats running on a second PC, which just scans the internet traffic from your main PC and then visualizes that data and sends to you. There are hardware hacks that do this too... Riot Vanguard doesn't stop any of it really, it stops software running on your PC.';

'>>1207775
Ah so another program that infiltrates my PC for no benefit. I was just playing Team Deathmatch and I see people who probably are free-aiming but have some kind of radar, as they were shooting me through walls consistently without me even peeking and getting headshot after headshot.

The only reason I even play this shit is because my demographic is egirls with daddy issues who like musty gamers for some fucking reason.';

'>>1206704
>playing fps at higher end mmr, do autistic things like jump maps or speed running,
Yeah this is exactly where all of the cheating happens too.
where else do you see rampant cheating if not speed running and fps games?
half of the ways they do that shit is thru finding glitches which ironically, as a community they declared was "acceptable"
>>1206704
>I think its far more likely that they are getting an inaccurate confounding variable where the transgender movement attracts a lot of mentally ill people looking for acceptance and stability or sociopaths that are looking to use a group's acceptance as a leg up for power and cheating to these groups doesnt matter because they do not feel empathy or sympathy for others. Its the same thing with pedophiles joining the trans movement or getting political positions or positions of power so they can rape kids or women
seems like a lot of cope here and excuses.
you admit the tranny movement attracts sociopaths, pedophiles, etc and then try to claim the article was just propaganda?
Do you even know what youre saying?
>>1206704
>Honestly the whole thing is probably fake and you shouldnt believe random pics on the internet. Nothing comes up when you google the dr's name and transgender self-identification. I mean even the term self-identification literally means NOT DIAGNOSED with gender dysphoria. I feel I have tourettes. I just self-diagnosed myself with tourettes. Very scientific.
more cope and word bullshit.
>>1206921
>ive been playing video games for 30 years 15 years longer than youve been fucking alive
AHH okay so youre a 50 year old tranny. it al makes sense now
YWNBAW';

'>>1206704
>>1210797
>Nothing comes up when you google the dr's name
forgot link:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reinhard_Pekrun
https://www.mcn.uni-muenchen.de/members/regular/pekrun/index.html

you know how i found it? i used Yandex, not Google you shit for brains faggot';

'>>1210809
No idea why people still use google when it was proven that they manipulate the results.';

'>>1211711
yep, suddenly multiple deleted posts after being called out';

'>>1211120
>Do you? Groups with positions of power attract psychos. Psychos have no interests in joining a knitting group. They become a state senator to hurt people they dont like by changing laws to fuck them over and get them fired. They become a ceo to treat people like shit. They join an LGBT group to pretend to be a counselor to get an LGBT kid alone because theyre vulnerable and have no support and are easy targets to build trust in. Stop living in memes and think for once in your fucking trailer trash malt liquor flavored life. Not like theres not tons of political people arrested for being pedos and what not. Just actively ignore that cause it doesnt fit your agenda, but its my scientific answer to a fucking T. Thats a joke son. Thats a joke. Get it trans son.
Based knower';

'Apex just got a massive cheating scandal in their highest tournament (ALGS) lol

It's unclear if the pros are cheating or they were "hacked" and given aimbots and radar';

'https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nf82nrDBcS0';

'>>1212075
Oldest trick in the book. I remember when some Siege pro got caught red-handed and banned by ubisoft itself, some hacker (really just a fucking fall guy) came out on twitter and said it was him who hacked the pro faggot. Then they unbanned the fag lmao.';

'>>1212168
The tournament organizers need to make money on this shit and they would lose tons of players and spectators if people knew that skill had very little to do with it. At this point it's mostly just people trying to avoid having a real job because there are no real jobs left we shipped them all overseas.';

'>>1212173
>skill had very little to do with it
Yeah, but I think it's obvious to any good player really. Being a "pro" means fucking nothing.';

'>>1212047
I don't know how we got on politics anyways but I'm amazed how unusable this site and so many others have become. Literally there's not a single person in a position of power anymore that isn't there to be a resentful lefty douchebag.';

'>>1212384
studies have shown that right wingers are willing to hire left wingers based on merit';

'>>1212384
>there's not a single person in a position of power anymore that isn't there to be a resentful lefty douchebag
This isn't true anymore. How can you genuinely say that after Musk took over shitter and turned it into his little conservative party?';

'>>1212994
Back from HG101 I see.';

'>>1213042
>HG101
Huh. I haven't used that site in like 10 years. Didn't know it was still around.';

'Based chinamen ruining the free time of western manchildren and making millions off it';

'>>1213042
What happened to Hardcore Gaming 101?';

'I'm starting to think it's not safe to play multiplayer games at all. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M_Gv2DJB2p4

And the funny thing is that I'm not even surprised by any of this shit. So many of these game devs seem fucking incompetent as fuck. Who's to say other mp shooters don't have zero day exploits like this that no one's ever heard of besides a handful of hacker autists?';

'>>1179524
Yes that's better in some ways but
- mods can be assholes
- no mmr so if you want to play competively it's a no go
- lower playerbase, sometimes the server is empty (or full)
- weird rules or server settings
for more casual games with lots of players in a match it's better, but many games these days are 5v5s or similar, doesn't work as well';

'Unironically unless hacking becomes against the law and actually enforced I don't think hacking rates will go down. The only other option is to ban non-whites from playing with white people but that's even less likely to happen.';

'>>1153535
It depends how competitive the game is. I remember seeing some video about how like 70% of the high level escape from tarkov matches had atleast 1 hacker. Same with csgo. Meanwhile I rarely notice any hackers on Arma3 because it is dying and they have allready all been banned. If you want something with less hackers I would try arma3 or some other game with a close knit community. Maybe like an older halo title.';

'>>1214573
Tarkov doesn't have an elo system, high level players and low level players play in the same raids, with the exception of one newbie map which has a level cap. The thing about Tarkov is, it's both unforgiving and you can make money off of cheating in it. Which is exactly why so many faggots do it. Those faggots who make money off of it usually make more than enough dosh to rebuy several accounts by the time they get banned. Carry services and rare item/expensive item RMT is huge in Tarkov as well. If no-skill shitters stopped buying these services and just played the fucking game and tried to get good at it, there would be way fewer cheaters, but they keep paying hackers wipe after wipe after wipe to carry them or find items for them, without realizing that they shit on their own head.';

'>>1214563
Cheating is against the law in China. People in China get arrested and sent to prison for years over it. Aaaand... that never really stopped anyone there.';

'>>1214763
you don't get it, anon. they deserve to have nicer stuff than you, AND their time is more valuable than yours. They're just better because they're clever enough to pay someone else to RMT for them. In all seriousness, it shows a severe enough lack of character that I would actually think it merits their execution. Death to cheaters and RMT paypigs.';

'>>1179489
picture needs to be updated. needs filters for "players who are winning to much" and "players that are losing to much" and mixes them.';

'>>1214573
You fucking thought, I’ve been subtly cheating on arma 3 for years';

'>>1212994
jfc tranny. you are genuinely retarded.';

'>>1215018
>Another retard in denial
Shut the fuck up, faggot.';

'seen many hackers in CS2 lately
Haven't seen many in pubg though you never know with wallhacks';

'>>1215700
I remember playing PUBG 6 years ago. It wasn't free-to-play back then and I even paid money for it. Not sure if they managed to find a way to keep Chinks on their containment server, but back then every single region was absolutely filled with Chinks. This one time I was playing 4 mans and this Chink on my team kept running around and showing us where all the good gear and guns were. Then suddenly he stopped and started screaming in broken English, telling us there's another team close by, and I don't remember exactly what he called one of the guys on the other team, but he kept panicking and saying something along the lines of "one of them is a cyber wizard like me", meaning there was another wallhacker on the other team and he knew where we were.

Looking back at it now, there were a lot more cheaters than I realized at the time.

This other time I went AFK in some random ass cabin, and when I came back there was an entire team of chinks all around me, saying shit in Chinese over VOiP and posing for screenshots next to my character and laughing. I downed one of them, but they instantly killed me. I think it's pretty clear now how they found me.';

'>>1216638
>Now the skins are all crazy neon colors and shit sponsored by kids gummy candy or some shit.
I don't know why faggot devs keep doing this. Change of art direction and clown skin spam is a huge turn off for me and one of the major reasons I quit games, up there with cheaters. It's why I stopped playing Siege. That game is basically unrecognizable now.';

'>>1214910
What are arma 3 cheats like? cheating in a milsim seems kinda weird';

'>>1216674
>What are arma 3 cheats like
Probably wallhacks that show you where everyone is. I don't know why anyone would use that though... Arma is boring as it is. Knowing where everyone is makes it 10000 times more boring.';

'>>1207775
wait, DMA cheats work on vanguard? it's truly over for video games, at least competitive ones';

'>>1216728
>DMA cheats work on vanguard?
They do, albeit some can get and have been detected in the past. But it doesn't stop them in real time, no.

>it's truly over for video games, at least competitive ones
This has been known for a while...';

'>>1216754
well if it starts impacting big companies like call of duty / microsoft we could see some law changes around cheat developers

right now they're able to sell their shit on the clearnet and in discord channels, if it becomes illegal it would be a lot harder for the average retard to buy cheats';

'>>1216760
Oh, it affects every multiplayer game. The issue is, legislators don't give a fuck.

>call of duty / microsoft
These kinds of big companies usually go directly after specific cheat providers who do the most damage. I guess lobbying old men to pass laws that make selling cheats illegal is kind of hard, since it's not something they're familiar with or even give a fuck about.';

'It doesn't really help that a lot of cheat providers are based in China, and no one could realistically do anything about those fuckers, even if it was illegal.';

'>>1216778
sure we could, just region lock china
the issue is that they are still paying customers, often paying more than the average western player since they buy the game multiple times';

'>>1216821
I don't mean cheaters, although they're a problem too, I mean cheat providers.';

'>>1216716
it better come with some aimbot because trying to snipe a very tiny box over 1000 meters sounds awful';

'>>1217501
There's CQB, and cheaters probably use sniper rifles for long range engagements anyway.';

'>>1153535
>DMA cheats practically undetectable
>Community crowdsourcing programs like CS Overwatch were botted for years.
>RMT adding gasoline to the fire
>Rootkits that do nothing.
>New fangled AI tech seems to have an easier time cheating than detecting cheats.
It’s so over.

In a way, matchmaking made this all inevitable.
The effort to herd all the players into one big blob.
No more niche community servers, just consoom that centralized, standardized e-sports competitive format.
Of course that would cause contagion and then an epidemic of cheating.
We must retvrn to community servers or multiplayer gaming is doomed.

>>1205817
I am pretty certain that streamers and content creators use DMA cheats, but it’s more about control than skill for them.
Something like radar can let you plot the pace of the game, how far away enemies are, how long you have to read chat, etc.
You can pick out where the biggest cluster of enemies is, which might be the most exciting thing for your video.
From an entertainer’s perspective, it’s just too useful a tool.';

'>>1217501
The input delay on arma is so bad an aimbot would make you too obvious.
Also everything is projectile based.
I guess you could have some kind of recoil script. Meh.';

'>>1218464
>I am pretty certain that streamers and content creators use DMA cheats, but it’s more about control than skill for them.
Something like radar can let you plot the pace of the game, how far away enemies are, how long you have to read chat, etc.
You can pick out where the biggest cluster of enemies is, which might be the most exciting thing for your video.
From an entertainer’s perspective, it’s just too useful a tool.
I've never really considered it, but it makes so much sense. Still have a hard time believing most of them cheat, because it's not always fun stuff, and quite a bit of it is pretty standard. But a lot of them use DMA cheats 100%.';

'FYI the tranny is a janny.
clean it up nigger';

'HE DOES IT FOR FREE';

'>>1220230
>HE DOES IT FOR FREE
The wolf?';

'>>1220308
Yes. They are very noble creatures.';

'>>1183677
Jfc what a freaking psycho.

I personally love to own shitters. For some reason I find it hilarious and it happens all the time. You can’t stop me with your puny paid cheats, noob';

'When I realized that I had been duped by the Jewish psyop that is video games I vowed to disrupt it as much as I could. Cheating is my way of carrying out the final solution, you can’t stop me.';

'>>1153535
I just want to fucking play warzone with cross play off. Fucking hell. I can't get into any fucking lobbies and I just play on ps5. Fuck. Seriously, it's so frustrating. I'm not itt at all and I have no idea how to fix this. I'm an old fart that just wants to play some games before I die.

Goddamn it.';

'>>1226105
Kys, for real. I'm not some schlomo and you're makinge miserable like they do in everyday life. Fuck you faggot';

'>>1231965
>playing COD
go fuck yourself';

'I would say the problem is that devs want more people playing their games even if it means "accidentally" not policing cheaters hard enough.';

'>>1183677
In old times ultima online I used to help new players then open a portal to the ice island and be like "THEEYA" and recall out after the portal closed.';

'third worlders corrupt everything';

'>>1153535
The stupid amount of metagaming ruined every online game for me, save for some niche games with low players numbers.';

'>>1239522
>niche games with low players numbers
These types of games are usually filled with lvl 10000000000000 old faggots who don't realize new games exist and are released every year. It's not fun playing against someone with so much game knowledge and play time.';

'>>1198815
???
noone is cheating at high end wtf are you saying
cheating is fucking obvious when ur streaming/playing scrims and playing on lans and people are watching you';

'>>1240160
>anon still thinks aimbot is visible to the human eye
oh you sweet child';

'>>1240160
ignore the /cs2g/ resident schizos';

'>>1153535
Nope. I always presume it's just because players are bad because when I play fps I tend to win and have ben kicked off out of servers, across multiple games, for cheating when I was not even using a mod.

Some of my memories in fps that stick out the most readily are when I'm soloing an entire time and getting kicked off for "being a hacking faggot" when in reality I was just that much better than everybody on the enemy team but people either think I'm a bot or cheating due to being that much better than them. I always presumed the same thing was going on in instances like this just with another top level boss player since people seriously could never cope with skill gap being a thing in video games. They honestly believed that the player could be that good and is the reason why they can't score a kill because I have seen hackers about a couple of handful of times since the first halo but it was always super obvious. Like they could fly or move around ultra fast or something.

However, I have witnessed people ban me, think I was a bot, or think I was cheating way more than actual cheaters so I always presumed the majority of complains always came from bad players because, especially in mmorpg worlds, people think the odds of victory are entirely down to programming and code when it's not. I'm playing lorto right these days and all I do is pve. I crit A LOT and I'm in my thirties with a 6% crit chance but I crit literally 99% of fights and on the fearless setting I keep dropping npcs, same level no less, in one to three button strikes because of how often I crit. That magic trick is a player skill because at 6% chance to crit, I should not be critting every pull with things typically die in one to three skills at my level due to crits. The longest streak I had of no crits was about three kills the other night and my crit rating was still 6%. If it was pvp, they'd be crying for a nerf.';

'Sad part is I didn't have the ability before. So if my crit was 6% it wouldn't be half to a third of my abilities critting. It would just be basic strategies, tactics, and mind gaming.';

'>>1245856
>an entire time
an entire team';

'>>1245856
>They honestly believed that the player could be that good
They honestly believed that the player could [never] be that good...

I just work up and am still in sleepy mode. Excuse me.';

'>>1245863
woke*

This will stop happening after being awake for a hour.';

'>>1245867
To bad I can't game 1 in 292,201,338 odd chances with one ticket blindly to win the power ball but I know if I had a live screen I could at least influence it while live.';

'Though I rose my crit rating up to 30%+ with crit rating and now I crit literally all the time.';

'It's about timing with game cycles more than anything else.';

'I learned of game cycles from playing old school doom too since all damage from monsters is a single number randomly multiplied by 1 to 8 and when I tripled monster damage in a mod I made, even imp fireballs would two shot me until I got good enough to time cycles that I'd allow myself to get hit and see the minimum damage apply and tank serval hits over the span of a very short time at minimum. Some other games have the same thing going just at a different frequency. People did always complain about rng generators not being truly random and in a way I understand what they meant. Not code wise necessarily, but gaming wise enough to take advantage of it.';

'For most people, it's me and my pc, but in my case, I'm part of my machine.';

'Bad players wont believe me though much like how bad players report/ban me for cheating for simply being better than their entire team in fps games. I hope you don't think it was aim assist because I personally have been hit with accusations like that as well.';

'>>1153535
Battlefront 2 ea is probably the only shooter worth playing these days that is remotely new because a lot of the unit abilities are literally just cheats with conditions, thus making everything outside of damage hacks not nearly as effective. Meanwhile in games like battlefield you have people in planes with wallhacks enabled lasering you with zero skill required in almost every lobby during prime hours.

Also Battlefront 2 is objectively more fun and fair than battleslop and it's not even close';

'>>1245856
>when in reality I was just that much better than everybody on the enemy team but people either think I'm a bot or cheating due to being that much better than them.
>I have seen hackers about a couple of handful of times since the first halo
You are very probably a cheater or a no life retard
Claiming to have never seen a cheater the way you did there also suggests youre absolutely retarded, or youre gas lighting people into thinking the problem isnt as bad as it is

I have run servers, its really fucking easy to stealth in and watch you play with full spectator vision. I have watched you fags follow shit thru walls only to whine and cry and bitch and moan about how we just cant handle how good you are when I ban you after having watched you for 3 matches follow people thru walls
And frankly, I had a couple I wasn't 100% sure on, but I still banned em, because some loser going 50 and 0 in a battlefield 3 match isn't fun for anyone.
So maybe they're that good, but I still don't care, they'd have to be absolute and total anti-social losers to be that good and not be cheating, so I'm doing them a favor regardless

>>1245907
>Bad players wont believe me though much like how bad players report/ban me for cheating for simply being better than their entire team in fps games. I hope you don't think it was aim assist because I personally have been hit with accusations like that as well
This always seems like a lie coming form you guys. I've seen people with VAC bans claim it was a false ban.
Funny part tho, I was the kind of admin who always immediately perma banned for VAC bans lol
So fuck you. And as above, if youre THAT good that people think youre cheating, I'm absolutely doing you a favor by banning you, because youre a no-life loser if youre that good.
I'll ban you to try and force you to go outside and touch grass
And meanwhile the average players (also the ones most likely to donate to keep the server up) dont need to be stomped by fags like you';

'>>1153535
just dont play games for normalfags
any game with community servers will be free of blatant cheaters';

'I got a PS5 for Demon Souls Remake and I've stayed for the no-cheats multiplayer.';

'>>1170038
Do you play on Xbox?';

'unfortunately anon, tarkov will never get rid of RMT and every single measure they have ever taken against it has failed and made the game significantly more annoying to play. if they cant legit cheat for items to later sell on g2g or funpay they will simply sell carries where they spin lobbies on brand new (stolen) standards. not to mention how antiplayer and antiskill the games mechanics have become. bsg had what was essentially the perfect arena shooter with crisp and snappy gunplay but decided to abandon that for a vision that can never truly be achieved due to the amount of varying playstyles everybody takes on. tldr: bsg are funhating faggots that never let the true potential of the game show and flourish into something more than it can ever be now.
and yes i know this post has little to do with cheaters but im just angry looking back at pre inertia footage and seeing paradise long lost.';

'>>1251494
There's always going to be people trying to cover up their bullshit. They all brag in the same way.';

'>>1252894
You fucking chimp.';

'>thread is the same few people responding to each other ad-nausea and agreeing with each other
the "everyone is cheating" threads are hilarious';

'>>1254560
Literally no one here has said "everyone is cheating". Encountering a blatant cheater every 5-7 matches is pretty bad. Only god knows how many closeted cheaters a game like that has.';

'The Cronus Zen (and other devices like it) are very likely the main culprit in what we see in the super majority of instances where we feel someone was cheating against us.
They work on PC as well, so even that's not safe.
It automates action combos, enables aim ass for KBM players (on console and PC, if PC has aim ass support), and has scripts for no-recoil.
And it cant easily be detected, especially if you use a passthru device to hide the source via a micro-controller.
These devices run $100, but work as a peripherial device and micro-controllers run between $20 to $40 off chink sites.
So lets pretend $200 to get this all set up. Short of the devs finding a way to block this crap, youre going to see people paying this much, because its a one time chance for an "I win" device.

More than anything else, these are the kinds of cheats we are seeing. Most players just want a simple aim assist lock on and some basic ways to automate their jumps, slides, side stepping, etc.
It's impossible for me to believe that a large number of players aren't using these things.
"Hacks" on the other hand are probably not even double digit percent outside of very specific game titles.';

'>>1255963
Yeah bro I literally set up like last year a keyboard under my feet under a pillow with all the keys disabled and changed keys to certain combinations using microsoft powertoys and was still able to beat runescapes bot detection stuff and got all my combats to 99 by literally playing the game in my sleep. These external things are on a completely different level. Runescape cant even detect the difference between me and my feet in my sleep playing.

Im sure theres lots of ingame mechanics you can abuse with millisecond perfections on key inputs to reload faster or cancel jump and things.
Tap that into some sort of thing like Hudsight or something with all these variables set up to gauge distances on crosshairs etc automatically, you automatically have a huge set of microadvantages that can push down the handicap for a player to make him appear to have the skill level of a player much higher in placements simply because everything he does is faster and every action he takes accumulates over time. He has more bullets reloaded, gets to loot faster, dodges better, etc. All while being that much more free to use his hands to prioritize aiming at you which also has further layers of automation. Throw any of that shit into like a diamond players hands, and it makes him a master or grandmaster.';

'>>1256384
Indeed.
It's not "hacks" that people are complaining about (at least they dont realize it isnt "hacks")
It's why half these niggers move half as fast and cant laser like they usually do in LANs.
They're not "hacking" they're just doing the equivalent of doping.
>doping was where bikers would add blood to their body before a big bike race in order to better oxygenate themselves during the race.
Thats all Lance Armstrong did.
So was he "legit"? Some people think so "because he did the rides".
But was he cheating? YES.
They had to go down to finally find a dude in the equivalent of the semi-pros to find someone who wasn't cheating.

This is why it's all so insidious too. These people FEEL like they're not cheating.
>"It's just an edge"
>"everyone does it"
>"I'm just automating a mundane task"
>"I'm just removing the RNG of recoil"
Fucking faggots, all of them.

Oh and based on automating Runescape.
Cheating to sidestep the bullshit treadmill of skinnerboxes is based.
>my only exception tho, otherwise it's fag behavior';

'I booted up BF1 for the first time in ages and remembered people on here saying it was full of cheaters as I got accused of hacking in my very first game.
>>1254560
Site is full of egotistical casuals now to whom any sufficiently good player may as well be cheating. It's impossible that someone is just better than them and even if they are then they must have devoted their entire life to it. Just look at the guy above you coping that it's fine he banned players he wasn't even sure were hacking because they must be losers for being that good. Those are the people crying about cheaters.';

'>>1258891
>be me
>playing in a 5 stack
>shitting on the other team
>gets to 9-0
>guy on the other team accuses us of cheating
>tells us he will show us how to really cheat
>goes full auto with a scout
>literally the same thing two games later
>quit
>play a few casual matches the next day to warm up
>half the people are obviously walling based on infoless prefires and preaiming off-angles consistently
>one fag is even using shit-tier aimware and is bouncing like he has parkinsons
>all the retards in the lobby are slurping their dicks about how great they are at the game
>quit before even attempting to queue premier
>some faggot on this shithole tells me I just suck and that cheating isn't an issue
sure, faggot, I guess it's just a skill issue.';

'>>1153535
The simple truth is that if you're playing a FPS then either you're a cheater or you're a second class citizen.
The people arguing against that are just people who love FPS games and are in denial. Sad.';

'>>1258891
what a bluepilled take lmao

keep being ignorant on how much hacking is going on';

'>>1259168
>second class citizen
Aka cheaters' entertainment/or a bunching bag for them to farm their kd/stats/points on.';

'>>1251494
>So maybe they're that good, but I still don't care, they'd have to be absolute and total anti-social losers to be that good and not be cheating, so I'm doing them a favor regardless.

This more or less.
Maybe they're not total anti-social losers but if they have a natural talent they should go join an amateur pro-league. The rest of us just wanna play in peace. I miss community servers and separate community-pro leagues. Now it's just matchmaking with unranked and ranked and neither are enjoyable.';

'pvp definitely.
I've been only playing pve coop shooters like DRG for the past years.';

'>The only shooters that I found have very few/almost no cheaters are HLL, Squad and Insurgency
>Insurgency
Insurgency Sandstorm was raped to death by bugs,spawncamping and high ranked premades shitting on new players.
Didn't need cheaters to kill that piece of shit.';

'>>1268806
>raped to death
I mean, the game was never really all that popular. But at least it is more popular than INS 2014. Seems to hold up okay playcount wise after 6 years.';